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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:28 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:45 pm
Posts: 38
Location: Chehalis Wa
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Hi everyone. Just bought an fl350 a couple weeks ago and wanted to thank everyone on here for so many great posts and topics. I don't know much about these machines but i feel like i can take on about breakdown with the info on here. My 350 is pretty stock. The guy i bought it from said it has a freshly rebuilt Engine with .20 bore. New connecting rod, bearings, seals. And boysen reeds. It has the vent mod to keep oil out of the starter and the oil holes in the piston. Is there anything i should check before i take it out and ride it hard? All the shocks are stock but all are in working condition. There is a little oil underneath the exhaust port is this a concern? Any help is greatly appreciated.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7698
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
That's a nice looking clean machine.
It has not been rolled. Top cage is straight.

If you got spooge near the exhaust port you need to verify where the leak is. Most of the time it is the fit between the pipe and the flange bolted onto the cylinder. Just clean it up and use high temp silicone.

Stock machines have non existent rear suspension. Honda really boo boo on the spring rate. When you get time and spare money buy some new springs at about #155. The oddy shocks are good enough but it is the spring rate that is wrong. You will hurt your back trust me.

I highly suggest you run high octane fuel.
I run straight Avgas. To save money you could run Avgas/premium fuel. I say this because you just said the guy you bought it from already over bored it. That tells me he blew it up. That's your first warning. Then he sold it to you -- that's your second warning. It's air cooled -- that's your third warning. Three strikes your out -- run Avgas. Bullshyte you say -- read all the poofkaboom threads.
Amen

Welcome new guy.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:01 pm 
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Posts: 38
Location: Chehalis Wa
I drained the fuel, picked up 5 gallons of 110 Sunoco fuel and mixed it 32-1. I went down to the parts store today and picked up 3 br9es plugs and a compression tester. The old plug in it looked perfect (to my eye) and I did a compression test. It was around 110. So I followed a few of the posts I saw on here and took the head off to see how many gaskets. 3 of them so I went with the slim one and put the head back on. Psi went up to 122. So I tried my very first plug chop ever (whooooo) I didn't do it right after reading some more Posts but here's what I did. Started it up let it warm up and went for about a mile ride with about half of it being at WOT (Wide Open Throttle). I did not turn it off and coast is I just ran it normally to is parking spot in the garage. Let it cool down a little and took the plug out. It looks pretty lean. I move the clip down 1 to the 4th clip And will try again tomorrow. Should I move it all the way down on my first run tomorrow. Thanks ehhh. Lol


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:18 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Johnnyp23 wrote:
I drained the fuel, picked up 5 gallons of 110 Sunoco fuel and mixed it 32-1. I went down to the parts store today and picked up 3 br9es plugs and a compression tester. The old plug in it looked perfect (to my eye) and I did a compression test. It was around 110. So I followed a few of the posts I saw on here and took the head off to see how many gaskets. 3 of them so I went with the slim one and put the head back on. Psi went up to 122. So I tried my very first plug chop ever (whooooo) I didn't do it right after reading some more Posts but here's what I did. Started it up let it warm up and went for about a mile ride with about half of it being at WOT (Wide Open Throttle) (Wide Open Throttle). I did not turn it off and coast is I just ran it normally to is parking spot in the garage. Let it cool down a little and took the plug out. It looks pretty lean. I move the clip down 1 to the 4th clip And will try again tomorrow. Should I move it all the way down on my first run tomorrow. Thanks ehhh. Lol


My honest opinion on plug chops (this will stir a hornets nest) is they are only good for full throttle runs.
My question is why are you moving a needle clip ?? How did you determine that was needed ??
You will find that Avgas does not color a plug like pump gas. I wonder if that 110 your running does the same. I think that 110 is good fuel.

If you have 110 psi compression that is a warning sign that ring lock has already begun on that new over bored set up. It probably started when the previous owner was running pump gas. It is a fresh bore with new piston I am presuming.

You found three gaskets (metal) because that is what the stock Honda is. Most of us remove all but one, use the thinnest one.

Did you pull the cylinder and verify that the rings are free to move in the piston grooves ?? Why not you were half way there already ??


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:22 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Hope you read this: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=17445&hilit=beginners+jetting


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:28 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Have you pressure/vacuum tested that Engine ??
Anytime you pull a two stroke apart you should do this to verify your rebuild.
You do this BEFORE you take it apart (to verify you had no leak when it blew up) and you do it AFTER you have put it back together to verify no leaks. This is always the routine and it is important, even though some don't do it. If you don't then you have missed a golden opportunity to find out why your Engine let go.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:30 pm 
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Location: Chehalis Wa
I feel like i should do some more reading before i pull the cylinder as i have never done that before. The reason for moving the clip is that the plug was fairly clean. I didnt know that it would be cleaner with 110 octane. What do you look for on the plug when running higher octane. When i removed the head everything looked brand new. I am hoping he broke it in. I will read that begginer jetting article


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:37 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Johnnyp23 wrote:
I feel like i should do some more reading before i pull the cylinder as i have never done that before. The reason for moving the clip is that the plug was fairly clean. I didnt know that it would be cleaner with 110 octane. What do you look for on the plug when running higher octane. When i removed the head everything looked brand new. I am hoping he broke it in. I will read that begginer jetting article


What to look for when reading a plug: I will be honest here and say that I am no good at it. But I do know from previous Engine poofkabooms that the plug had visible signs of aluminum flakes or spots on it. When I look at a plug that is what I am really interested in. Also if it is black that is a dead give away as well. So if it is really clean and has flakes or is really black then do something about it.
This is what a Avgas plug looks like when jetting is good


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:41 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Almost forgot to add this VERY IMPORTANT item.
Your fuel pump MUST pass the 4.5oz in 10sec approx test.
If its not putting that out then don't even start your machine again.
Buy a new pump. I use a pump from a polaris machine part #3085275
You will have to make a new bracket for it if you decide to buy this one but it does bolt into the same location if you make a plate.

Edit: you are wasting your time jetting if the pump don't put out


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:50 pm 
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Location: Chehalis Wa
My plug chop


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:00 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
I don't really feel qualified to direct your jetting based on that pic but it does look lean.
It could be caused by a few things. One is a fuel pump not putting out enough fuel or it could be an air leak or it could be that, that is what 110 fuel looks like. Not sure.

So how did you figure it was the needle position ?? Your needle is just mid range jetting.
I would start at Engine pressure test then fuel flow rate and then use the beginners jetting guide.

Edit: You will find that the stock jetting recommended for the carb you are running will be very close (within about two jet sizes) to what you will end up running.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:45 pm
Posts: 38
Location: Chehalis Wa
Ho do i measure the fuel pump outlet? I feel like i owe you a beer already


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:10 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7698
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Johnnyp23 wrote:
Ho do i measure the fuel pump outlet? I feel like i owe you a beer already


The way I do it is to:
1) remove the fuel line from the carb and put it into a measuring cup
2) with no ignition on (you don't want it to start) crank the Engine over with the starter. Use a stop watch and crank it for 10 seconds
3) you need 4.5oz in 10 sec approx

I assume you don't have to be warned about fire right ??
If you are getting like 2oz or 3oz your dead.

thx for the beer offer but I don't drink or smoke.
Almost 58 now and never smoked a dube in my life


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:14 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Here is a recent and good thread on fuel pump issue and something to keep in mind: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=17704


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:26 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
I just want to comment on that machine again.
Looking closer at those pics tell me that it is in show room condition.
I see that it has the original front bumper rubbers on the ends of the tubes. The Honda stickers on the main tube are not worn at all. The red kill switch not sun faded. Bolts on the roll bar tubes are still black. Looks like original tires. Seat belts are not sun faded. Seat new condition.
Very very nice. Show room quality. Someone did a great resto job or it has very little hrs on it.
Pardon my noseyness but how much did you pay and where did you get it ??


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2017 11:45 pm
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Location: Chehalis Wa
I got it down in beaverton oregon. I think i am the third owner. He said it sat for a long time before he bought it and rebuilt the Engine. It was for his wife and she only rode it a couple times. I paid 3000 for it and a single axle trailer. He said it is all original. And from what i can see it is in almost perfect condition. Im at work but i will try and get it out and take a few more pics when i get home. The garage light does not do it justice.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:01 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
From what I see there, if you paid 3G for that and a trailer then I'm callin the cops. You stole it for that price. Nice score.
I check craiglist and kijiji every day and never see this stuff for sale. WTF.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:15 pm 
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Location: Chehalis Wa
I agree i got a good deal on it. The only problem is i have this machine that is in great condition and i know that im gonna take it out and beat the shit out of it. I told my wife after a few days of having it that i was thinking of selling it to someone who would preserve it and buy one (or trade) for one that is in good running condition but not cosmetically as nice. Do you think it would be a wise decision to do so? Or should i just keep it and baby it?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 6:31 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
I would buy another one to beat the crap out of. That one is valuable in my opinion. Drive it but be nice.
I own three of them and only my brother an I drive. One is always in for repair because of crashes. However we have slowed WAY DOWN since I broke my back in a crash. Unfortunately we only went out 3 times this year and no drama. My engines no longer an issue.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:44 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:39 pm
Posts: 682
Location: Sacramento
Johnnyp23 wrote:
i was thinking of selling it to someone who would preserve it and buy one (or trade) for one that is in good running condition but not cosmetically as nice. Do you think it would be a wise decision to do so? Or should i just keep it and baby it?



Ride that sucker!!! Honda didn't build them to be stared at. Go out and enjoy it. Did you buy it as an investment to stare at or an investment to have fun riding??? ::-: ::-: ::-: :-) :-)

My 2 cents. I bought 4 of those things a couple years ago and enjoyed the heck out of them and sold them for what I had in them. Now have 5 Pilots and ride the heck out of them.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:38 pm 
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Location: Chehalis Wa
Ok so i have a few questions. You were spot on, i am thinking the fuel pump is toast. I am only getting a little over 2oz with ten seconds of cranking. My bigger concern is the coompression and rings. I did a few more compression tests tonight and i keep getting 110 with the electric starter and 120 if i pull start it. It dooes not change at all with the throttle open or closed. I decided to take the head off and take a few pics. 3 questions. 1. Could low compression be the reason for not enough fuel when i checked. 2. Do the small scratch marks in the pics mean i have bad rings. And 3. What is the best way to remove the cylinder if needed and is it easy to put back on. My buddy was saying something about a toool that compresses the ring? I don't want to get myself in a hole i cant fix.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:41 pm 
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I forgot the pics


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:23 pm 
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1) Answer: No -- 110 psi is more than enough to work the fuel pump
2) Answer: No -- You want to see those marks. They are caused by the honeing stone. Looks very good.
3) Answer: It is always easier to get the cylinder off with the Engine out of the chassis because you can't get at the base nuts. Work area to cramped.
4) My buddy was saying something about a toool that compresses the ring? : You don't need that tool. I just compress each ring with my fingers when I install the jug. Should be no problem. One thing I will warn you about is sometimes a ring will slip out of position if you get ramy. Then the jug won't just fall into place. That's the indication. The jug must just slide down onto the studs freely. NO HAMMERS.

Also noted that you said the compression did not change with the throttle open or closed. That statement tells me you don't have a lot of experience at this do you ?? Just asking so I know how detailed I need to be with any answers.
Compression test always taken with throttle full open.

Edit: It looks like you cleaned up any carbon deposits with a rag didn't you ?? That thing looks way to clean. I also see very early evidence of the piston getting hot (the discoloration at the top of the piston).


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:28 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
If you do decide to pull the jug then what you are looking for is the rings stuck or not moving freely in the piston.
When you put it back together I would put a bit of red high temp silicone on the base gasket to make sure it seals. It MUST be a metal gasket not paper. The paper one will blow out.

I'm going out to the shop to work on my machine now so may not get back to you fast.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:00 am 
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Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:45 am
Posts: 252
Location: South Haven, MI
Looks like a super clean machine, great buy!!! Sometimes the cleanest machines are that way because the previous owner(s) couldn’t get the machine to ever run right. I’ve got 2 machines, the one that runs out crazy fast is the one that shows it’s age. The one that is pretty the previous owner couldn’t get it running well, so it sat and sat. Now that it’s been straightened out it won’t be nearly as pretty!!!

Good luck with your purchase! This site is amazing because of the people, they are crazy knowledgeable, they are super willing to help and share their knowledge with you to get you running and keep you running!!!


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