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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:35 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:33 pm
Posts: 945
Location: Rhode Island
So I started to reassemble my suspension tonight and ran into a road block. I started by installing my new upgraded speedchaser bushings in my J-srms. Put them in the freezer over night, and tapped them in my J-arms with a rubber mallet, easy enough. My issue is that they will not install on the frame mounting points. I cleaned up the frame mounts, they are smooth as butter. I measured the stock mounts, and the J-arm bushings and they are the exact same. Should there be some difference, even just a little bit? I thought that is what the shims were for? I tried to force the J-arm on the mount with a mallet but could only get it 60% and it would not move up and down at all, I had to put my body weight on it just to get it to budge a little bit.

Any suggestions or insight would be greatly appreciated.

Here are some pics for reference. The last pic is a extra j-arm I had with a OEM bushing. Much bigger then the Speedchaser ones.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:44 pm 
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Location: Rhode Island
Also, he bushings were at room temp when I tried to install, not still cold from the freezer.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7698
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
From what I can see there the shaft comes in at 1.064 and the speedchaser bushing is 1.064 so that is size for size and should go. However the J arms are cast and one of yours may have a high spot inside and is squeezing a new bushing. I doubt Honda ran a reamer into these cast J arms.
As for the OEM being much larger as you say --- well as I see it there in the pic, it comes in at 1.070 and in my opinion that extra .006 will cause J arm play.
Not sure what to suggest here other than to measure the bushing on the inside with a set of snap (bore) gauges if you have them. I am azzuming you are doing both sides so are both sides doing the same thing ??
My money is on a high spot inside the J arm swelling the new bushing but not sure.
You also need a bit of oil on that shaft before you pound it on. It can't be dry.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:42 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
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Location: Carson City NV
It's my guess that one of the bushings is cocked on the bore of the arm.

Rand


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:08 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:33 pm
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Location: Rhode Island
Every j-arm is doing the same thing. Both sides top/bottom. I can try some oil I thought the grease would have done the trick. Also, I measured both sides.

Could they still be cocked if the ends are flush on the j-arms?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:16 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
CurtisR401 wrote:
Every j-arm is doing the same thing. Both sides top/bottom. I can try some oil I thought the grease would have done the trick. Also, I measured both sides.

Could they still be cocked if the ends are flush on the j-arms?

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In my opinion if they are mounted flush it should be good.
I just went out and measured the stuff on the death machine I am rebuilding. The J arm shafts on mine come in at 1.061 or .003 smaller than yours. I also measured the bushings on the J arm shafts (and they do look like new to me) and they came in at 1.064 same as the ones you got from speed.
Not sure what to tell you at this point.

Edit: Just thought of something. Try to take out a speed bushing and see if it will go onto the J arm shaft all by it's lonesome. Hope you can get it out without damaging it. If you are not sure you can take it out without mucking it up then don't try this. (Brass or aluminum punch).


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:36 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Well looky what I just found in my parts box.
Factory OEM J arm bushings.
Pics show the factory dimensions of these bushings.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:37 am 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
two more


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:39 am 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
From what I see here the speedchaser bushings are factory ID in size.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 4:49 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
Try sliding the arm on the post but only slide it on as far as the inner busing only. Does it slide onto the post without it binding? If it doesn't then the bushing more than likely got deformed when being pressed into the arm.

If it slides onto the first bushing freely then binds when the second bushing is slid onto the post then the bushings are not parallel.

Rand


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:33 pm
Posts: 945
Location: Rhode Island
Thanks for the help and suggestions guys, I really appreciate it!

I do not have a bore gauge but might be able to borrow one from a friend. I will likely not try to remove them at this point in fear of damaging them. I did my best to make sure they went in evenly when I installed them but maybe I did damage them or cocked them?

I did try to install just one end on the shaft and it would not go, I flipped it over just to check the other side and same thing.

I’m going to work on it today and will let you know if I find a solution.

One thing is for certain, my shaft is bigger than yours CO. :-)
I’ll measure my other frame to compare.

One thing I thought of last night was to run a small Engine/brake hone through the new bushings and try to open it up / fix any defects from installation. Let me know what you guys think about that.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 1:30 pm 
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Location: Hope, B.C Canada
CurtisR401 wrote:
One thing is for certain, my shaft is bigger than yours CO. :-)
I’ll measure my other frame to compare.

One thing I thought of last night was to run a small Engine/brake hone through the new bushings and try to open it up / fix any defects from installation. Let me know what you guys think about that.


1) Yes that may be but I actually have the skills to over come that

2) I like the brake hone idea


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:33 pm
Posts: 945
Location: Rhode Island
canadian oddy wrote:
1) Yes that may be but I actually have the skills to over come that

2) I like the brake hone idea


LOL I hope you had a chuckle CO! There is no doubt that your skills surpass most, including myself.

I did get every J-Arms on today and they fit like a glove. I tried the hone at first but had no luck. I then reamed out each bushing just a smidge till it slipped on the shaft with no play side to side, up or down and using oil instead of the grease. After that I went back to the hone to smooth out the bushing.

I did measure my other frame and had the same 1.064 on the frame mounting shaft.

Thanks again guys!

Tools I used:

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2007 7:45 am
Posts: 1040
Location: hole above ground
WOW sorry for you inconveniences

The best way to install bushings

1) drive out old bushings

2) clean bore

3) polish out bore of j arm look for dents and nicks (note in the middle of j arm there is a area that has never been used because of the shorter stock bushing )

4) clean bore

5) on bushing the first .100 is stepped and should just slid in

6) before driving in check and make sure the bushings slide on the cleaned frame shafts all of them

7)The First bushing Now it is best to press them in then beating them in with a BFH but most of us do not have a press

So you will need a 27mm bolt or A 1" bolt might work as well or a headed pin that slides in the bushing so it pushes in the center of the bushing
the bushing should just >>>>Tap<<<< in to the bore. not pound if it dose the bore on the J-arm need more Polishing deburing

8) Second bushing At this time the J-Arm should slide onto the shaft with just one bushing even if its gets put on backwards
so slide it on the take the second bushing and put on the shaft and a piece of pipe or tube so you can >>>>Tap<<<< the second bushing in to the J-Arm as your doing this make sure the j-arm is not binding on the shaft by moving it up and down . this process keeps it all straight as you tapping the bushing in

Hope this helps

SpeedChaser


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:33 pm
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Location: Rhode Island
No problem at all Speed, I am certain that it was my installation method. I do not have a press, I have what most would consider a poor mans workshop. I try to use what I got, borrow from friends, or buy tools as I need them. Thanks for the tips, next time I'll take my time and do it right but this will do for now. :-)


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 3:38 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7698
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
I would just like to add one more comment and some pics before we put this thread away.
Below are some pics of a J arm I am rebuilding for the death machine rebuild. A close look and you can clearly see all of the corrosion beyond the end of where the bushing stops. The stock bushings are quite short and the ones speedchaser makes are longer. The longer bushings are better and provide more stability (for the lack of a better term) than the short factory bushings. When I make new bushings I also make them longer for this very reason. If you pounded in speeds new bushings before you really cleaned up this area then that is probably why you had your installation issues. It put some squeeze on that new bushing and swelled it. It don't take much because everything is a size for size fit.
Earlier in this thread I suggested you pound out one of the new bushings and see if it fits on the shaft. I feel at this point that it was bad advise because as I was taking the old bushings out of this J arm one of them actually shattered into pieces :shock: . Not sure if the metal was work hardened after all these years or what, but if you would have damaged one of the new bushings I would not have felt good about my advise.


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