Ok now I got it.
You have to add two numbers to get that 103 lbs you need.
I was looking at the chart and trying to find the 103 lbs in one of the position boxes and that happens to be position #4.
I wasn't adding the spring preload and spring poundage together to get that 103. I was just looking for a box that showed 103 in the spring poundage section.

Edit: Can you explain these two: "Honda base line" and the line below it says "race tech confirmed". What is that ??

I know your chart is accurate or at least goddamn close because of the spring on my brothers machine and the preload and spacer I had to make.

CO if you can give info I can refine to be more accurate.
Here is an example for Terry H set up This should give an idea of how it work for a comparison.
What this does is show the difference between spacer thickness for SPL (Static Pre Load) and adjuster position related to sag (droop) in shaft travel.
Hopefully this start to paint a picture.

CO forgot, Honda base line is 505 for most rates in bikes quads etc. Race tech is there rate calculator advanced.

I think TerryH is 250 lbs ----- not sure so maybe he will chime in to verify.

So it looks like that 185 lb/in spring he bought is good for a 210 lb guy.
Am I reading that right ??

This is great stuff. Great work adnoh.
This is what Honda should have done in 1985.

We still have more charts coming right adnoh ??

I am 250. Interested to see how the 185lb springs I have in it now perform. Maybe the rock hard OE springs were made for fat guys?

CO, yes once we have confirmation from Terry h. Hate to see owners buying spring and not work.

Terry H , one time fee had said they set them for large people.

I will do one with 185 spring and ridder at 250.
I will play with the SPL. And see how it comes out.
I will use his spacer for a base line and see how it comes out.

Thank you!

BTW...'round here I'm below average. My son is 6'6" and 340. lol...

sorry I meant to say Lee.

Good morning all. What I did is make up two different models of the chart to compare Terry H set up using the 185 spring. The first is his spacer which adds 92.5 lbs of static pre load to the shock and the second with a spacer thickness supping zero static pre-load.
I added a line of reference “Difference”. What this means is the amount of force require starting the shock compression. This additional force is required to overcome the spring force applied to the shock.
Important item here for math to be relevant would be corner weight and balance %. Once Terry has assembled the machine He can simply get those numbers easily. He first fills all the fluids and places a bath scale under the rear tire. Logs that number and then puts on whatever gear he wears and does it again, then places the scale under one of the front tires. This confirms the balance and corner weight numbers
Rear Corner weight no rider__________________________
Rear Corner weight rider and gear _____________________
Front Corner weight rider and gear_____________________
Now we look at the effects on the shock. Has the shaft moved under the weight of the machine wet (full of fluid) and has it moved under weight of machine with Rider and Gear.
Spring stake Static___________________
Spring stack Wet_____________________
Spring stack Wet, Rider and Gear______________________
Now we can take this information and compare to see if the chart works, need refined or just plain junk.
No matter what it will provide very important information to use as a guide.
Adnoh

Thanks adnoh! I am just short of clueless on how to read and apply all these values but I assume that position 3 is the best?

It seems straight foreword to me.
In that first chart he shows you have some kind of spacer that you made that adds static pre-load to the shock. The key here is in the top left of that chart - the green numbers. You want 15% sag and you need 123lbs to get it. Now you look at the "Position 1" chart. You add the SPL number and the SP number together and it must be 123lbs. If it's not then you got no sag. Obviously in that first chart you got no sag.
In that second chart you do the same thing. You see that if you use no spacer that adds pre-load you get a lot closer to that 123lbs needed for some sag. You see that in blue in the "Position 3" chart. You add those two numbers again. You are around 139lbs instead of 123lbs so you got a bit less than the 15% sag we were shooting for if you don't make a spacer that adds pre-load.
I was asking adnoh for 15% sag instead of the 30% most machines run because our oddys have a pathetic amount of travel to begin with and we have a bump snubber which takes up even more of our pathetic shock travel. I plan on cutting my snubbers in half and in fact I have already done this on one of my machines (my personal machine).

I am a bit lost on that BOP (bottom out percentage) number.
Adnoh shoots for just over 500 lbs but yours is through the roof at over 700 lbs. I am not sure what this means at the end of the day though because your a bit fluffier than I am and that puts a lot more load on everything.

Basically from the info I have gleened in this thread we need a spring rate of 140 to 185 for any of the drivers here. That covers a range of 130 lb to 250 lb drivers.
There we go guys -- that's what we needed.
Thanks adnoh.

P.S. adnoh -- if you feel like it do a completed chart for a 180 lb driver. That covers probably half of the guys that run these things.

This is one of the best threads of recent times in my opinion because it gave us badly needed info.

Terry H, if you would like I can do my best to explian the numbers and how they relate. It would be good to know if you want. It will also help understand some of my babble.
If others want I can post here or in new thread. Terry's choice

CO, BOP is basically the spring force compressed at a given distance. Take the shaft laenght times the rate plus any static pre load. What I look at is the wheel rate for a given sprung weight. This is a better gauge of where you need to be. Trying to keep it simple so I am using the springs rate for chart. This is why I have to determine a corner,unsprung to get a sprung weight. The weight the shock supports.

Yes please do explain here. I'm sure there are others that have little knowledge of these things besides me. I would like to understand more about it.

Ok, I'll start working something up.

I installed the springs tonight.
It will be a week probably before I can even think about a ride and a ride report.
In the pics you will see my old set up.
I did not tell anyone or post about this set up, but a couple of members knew.
What I did was use stock FRONT springs and then cut the old rear springs to make up the difference in length. It worked very well believe it or not. My brothers machine came with #130 springs when I bought it and this set up felt very similar to those. It was way better than NO rear suspension with the original stock rear springs that the oddy has. I ran this set up on two machines. The death machine still has this. If these new Eibach springs work out then I will buy another set and install on the death machine.

Adnoh: According to your spring chart I needed #140 springs set in the #3 position.
I could not get #140's from Eibach so I got #145's. I set them in the #1 position.
Will report here when I can.
CO

look forward to the report to see if were on the right track.

Hopefully mine will be running in the next week or so. Still more to finish up after that but at least I can get some sort of initial idea. I've stood on the rear and the still seem pretty stiff.

Well we went on a short 2 hr ride today (without my brother who hasn't been out in 2yrs).
The death machine with the homemade head and welded piston wouldn't run right as soon as it came off the trailer. It's still that fuel issue and apparently it's not fixed yet. We left the beer poacher behind at the truck. His son in law and I took off. The kid was running my brother machine -- it ran fine. I was in mine with the new springs. It also ran fine.
Now a ride report on the springs:
I am 135 lbs and running the #145's in the first position at the start of the ride.
They seemed a bit soft as I bottomed out a few times but man what a difference. I didn't even feel the bumps and it was a totally different machine. I now understand the reason for sag.
I stopped and went to the max preload setting. It was now a stiffer machine to me but I only bottomed out once.
Keep in mind that I run on logging roads and they are rough to say the least. Boulders, sticks and unseen washouts that jump out of no where.
So from what I can gleen from this ride is that the #145's for a 135 lb guy would be awesome for a good road but you have to run a stiffer set up on the rough stuff. I did not try to jump the oddy. I never do this anyways. I don't think a guy can jump this set up as it would be to soft in my opinion. Handling was great on the smooth sections of this logging road with the soft initial set up.
All in all I am happy with these springs and I have some adjustment.

Edit May 23: Hey Adnoh I did a rough and dirty measurement in the shop before I left on how much sag I had on those springs. I lifted the machine with a jack (wheels still on ground) and took a measurement. Then I let it down and jumped on the back a few times. Took a measurement. It was approx 1 1/2" lower. It was fully loaded with fuel etc. I don't remember off hand what the total wheel travel is on these things. Not sure if this helps with calculations.
CO

Sounds like a win to me.

You should take more ride pics, they are gorgeous.

CO. good info to use.
You want the machine to bottom out once or twice. That is one of the goal for proper set up. When you read about setting look for words like "excessive or lack of."
One should also look at you ride set up with additional weight to the rear of the machine. This will change load at the spring static (just sitting there) and the dynamic (in motion) based on the leverage force behind the wheels.

Since you went to full pre load on the adjuster.
Go back to chart: find the poundage You added log it.
if your sag was 1.5 " change your cut spacer or space the spring (using shims) to achieve a 1" sag and rest you pre-load adjuster to the middle postion. then you can dail it in for your set up. Once happy then cut new solid spacer or work on dual rate set up for soft ride and better bottom out poundage. Real world number make a huge difference. Thank you

Remember to log all changes:
spring height static before and after assembled
solid spacer thickness
shim thickness
pre-load adjuster position
Weight on tire (Bath scale under each tire)

All these numbers can be turned in to a spring poundage for set up and change in set up. Others can use this to dial in there machines. Like extra fuel load, tire, rider weight etc.

Adnoh

First real chance to ride the 350 pretty briskly today. Hauled it up to the open field by my work. Field is really rough. Big whoops on the back side. The whoops caused the rear end to be in the air but no bouncing on the landing. Just land and go. Quite happy with the spring change.

Vid of the last few laps of the day...

Awesome results. Need to see a real ride with some mountains and trails and....turns...haha.

Thanks. Still doing some tuning at this point. Like to make sure everything is right before getting too crazy.