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PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 1:21 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 1:06 pm
Posts: 185
Location: Aurora, IL
Nice score on the sled! I wouldn't have bought anything else from me either if I had a line on that! :-)


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2012 1:31 pm 
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Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Nelly wrote:
Nice score on the sled! I wouldn't have bought anything else from me either if I had a line on that! :-)


LOL!


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 3:19 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Well, I picked up the donor sled on my lunch hour today. The Super Buggy project has an Austrian powerplant!

CL ad says it was a 1998, but in looking at the OEM parts diagrams I couldn't match the body to a 1998. Determined it had to be 1990-93. And I was right. Right there for the world to see on the side of the sled is the VIN plate with clearly printed mgf month and year, "OCTO 1990". Now I knew I was gonna get a good price. Then he couldn't get the Rotax 467 (not 494 like the '98 would've had) started, not to mention, he had both plugs out and was tightening the head bolts. Now I REALLY KNEW I was gonna get a good price, LMAO. Battery is dead, so he's pull starting it with no success. It's flooded. He pumped the primer 50 times and I could see the piston domes were wet. Spark was solid. I get my new gel battery out of my tool box, hook it up, and notice the old liquid battery was dry as a bone. Engine turned over 25-30 times and came to life. Rev'd it a couple times to get the flood out and she sounded good. By now it had started to rain - pennies from heaven. Offered him $220 cash and he caved. Backed my trailer in, slid it on, got the bill of sale signed, and off I went. Nothing like buying a sled in August!

She also has speedo, tach, and twin temp gages; electric & pull start; primer; twin mikuni carbs; air box; thermostat.

Head pipe sticks out far due to the splitter, but I'll have to do some homework & fab work for fitting this in the rear of the buggy frame (obviously).

Sled has a title and is pretty clean, so I know I can make-up most of the expense by parting the carcass out once Engine & peripherals are out. Figure I can eBay the hood, windshield, seat, track, bogies, bars, rad, shocks, gearbox, and skis cheap & fast later this year closer to the cold weather. But its not coming apart until I'm totally ready to start the project. I've got all the parts, just need to finish a few other things and make it a priority. Done buying crap for a while!! Got my Zilla for sale, my hot tub for sale, and my house for sale. LOL TOOOOO much going on right now!!


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 3:44 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
Great score you will love that Engine.

The manifold I used was pretty much the same thing I angled it down then turned towards the clutch side then put a turn on the pipe worked out pretty good.

http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/viewtopic.php?t=800

Image


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:20 pm 
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Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Yep, planning something similar for this pipe along with locating / welding mounts to match the stock mounts. If I eff it up, I'll track down another stock pipe. Too easy to cut & weld versus dropping $300 on the eBay one (Farr-Offroad).

I may just have to break down and buy one of their FL-Rotax Engine mount kits so I don't have to worry about alignment and fab. $100...worth it. Although I am close to ordering a 4x4 sheet of misc plasma cut parts and could have the pieces burned. Not sure...will cross that bridge when I get to it. I've got seventyeleven other things to machete through so I can get to this fun-fun-fun project. :-)


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:41 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:18 pm
Posts: 25
that sled is a nice buy.

1 year ago i bought a 1990 skidoo 580 for $300, and started the swap.
If you buy the rotax conversion Engine mount from Farr-offroad, you will not be able to keep the pull start with out modifying the frame.

I caved and bought an exhaust from him. (I have no welding skills)

No matter what, in the end you will love the extra power.

Good luck on the build.


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File comment: Donor sled
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File comment: Engine mount
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File comment: Mostly finished project
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 6:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
But you managed to make a mount that allowed you to keep the pull start? Why does their design require that?


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 7:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
Look at making your own Engine mount I kept mine as low in the cage as I could to lower center of gravity and to make room for the cooling system and gas tank http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/viewtopic.php?t=710

Cant really tell for sure in the pics but it looks like that mount waste a lot of space in the Engine compartment that could be used for other things.

What carb setup you going to use if your using the stock carbs you will probably need the higher mount .


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 7:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 2:18 pm
Posts: 25
Ill try and get some better pictures.

the placement of the Engine that far over was so the clutches would line up, and with this pre made Engine mount the frame wasn't wide enough to get the pull start in also.
If you make your own mount and keep it nice and low you might be able to squeeze in the pull start.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2012 9:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:24 pm
Posts: 135
Location: Cincinnati Ohio
I used the farr mount and his pipe, the mount can't be lower with the carbs you have on that sled, any lower and they will hit the trans, that's why the mount is angled, maybe a differnt carb setup will work like seedoo carbs, Hoser would know that. that's the same Engine that I used, make sure you keep everything until you are done.... RUN THE FUEL PUMP!!!! As far as the Farr mount and pipe, it was not alot of $$ to save the time of fabbing and locating if you are in a hurry.
Here is why it needs to be high in the rear notice the clearence to the trans
Image
Image


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:14 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Ah, I see. Makes sense now. Using the stock trans is a necessity. I'll look into those Sea Doo carbs. My bro-in-law used to race jetski's back in the late 80's early 90's, so he may have a carb for me.

Got the battery in the sled permanently and she starts, idles, and revs very nice...especially for only a couple hundred $'s!

Only other sled I've owned was a '79 Yamaha Enticer 340 (which I donated its Engine to an FL250). And this Ski Doo is HUGE compared to the other old girl.

Don't think I'm gonna start tearing into this buggy until my LT500R sells. I need the room. Can't destroy the garage with the house being toured every few days.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 11:00 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Do any of those single carb manifolds for the 587 fit on the 467/470? There are a few manifolds and even one "kit". Anyone suggest a website / catalog for rotax & seadoo stuff? Much appreciated.

I may be bringing home the empty frame tomorrow to add the stock suspension, trans, and axles so I have a legitimate roller. Sick of dragging it around (and I have wheels/tires for it now). I'm getting excited about this project more & more. More than anything, I'm glad to be making progress again on my herd.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 12:00 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
Do any of those single carb manifolds for the 587 fit on the 467/470? There are a few manifolds and even one "kit". Anyone suggest a website / catalog for rotax & seadoo stuff? Much appreciated.

I may be bringing home the empty frame tomorrow to add the stock suspension, trans, and axles so I have a legitimate roller. Sick of dragging it around (and I have wheels/tires for it now). I'm getting excited about this project more & more. More than anything, I'm glad to be making progress again on my herd.



The manifold I used is off the older 580 SeaDoo fit right on my 440 and will fit the 467cc Engine I have I never tried it on the 583 I have but it appears to be the same bolt pattern no doubt I will have to mate the manifold to the Engine (port match) to take advantage of the gains that comes with the larger 583 Engine.

Search evilbay for seadoo manifolds and super BN carbs intakes etc. if you take your time you can find many deals some guys think they are made of gold and want top dollar others sell them dirt cheap, I bought like 3 manifolds 5 carbs all for under 100 bux I have one 2 carb intake and 2 of the single carb intakes after running this Engine in my Pilot I am really happy with the single carb, the second manifold I bought so I could try a 40mm or 44mm single carb (forget what size they actually are the one bigger than the 38mm) but don't see where I need the bigger carb.

You want the newer carbs with the square fuel pump on them NOT THE ROUND pump they are the old style and I guess are not as good, never tried one.

Nice thing about the water craft carbs is the thumb pull is almost nothing my setup (single 38mm carb no oil injection) is easier than the 39mm carb I had on the Pilot original Engine, dual 38mm or 40mm sled carbs will kill your thumb in a Pilot.

Some searches http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=super+BN&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=

Weed through the shit http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=seadoo+intake&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=

Skip right over them parting mutts that are taking everything apart like the intake manifold and trying to sell each part separately get the whole manifold 2 of the 3 I bought came with the oil pumps and lines still installed http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=seadoo+intake+manifold&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=

This guy is selling the whole package http://www.ebay.com/itm/Seadoo-580-587-rotary-valve-cover-complete-with-carb-and-oil-pump-/320959788175?pt=Personal_Watercraft_Parts&hash=item4abab1b48f&vxp=mtr

If you feel the need to buy a rebuild kit get the GENUINE MIKUNI kit not the knockoffs that litter the internet.

You will need one of these if you go without the choke single primer kits are cheaper shop the web price really varies on these http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dual-primer-kit-mikuni-carb-jet-ski-Seadoo-watercraft-/330599914081?pt=Personal_Watercraft_Parts&hash=item4cf94a5a61&vxp=mtr


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 2:52 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Awesome, many thanks for the help Hose'!

I pinged a few local SeaDoo parts guys around my area to see if anyone has anything.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:33 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Wow, compression for DAYS!! 170-175 both jugs with WOT (Wide Open Throttle) and fresh battery. Money well spent. :)


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:01 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
Wow, compression for DAYS!! 170-175 both jugs with WOT (Wide Open Throttle) and fresh battery. Money well spent. :)



Great score do a little research see if that is one of them engines where some of the crank bearings you have to grease? Recall seeing Baz talking about it on the newer ROTAX engines good time to do this is when the Engine is out.

A pressure test might be a good idea too.

Bet you can sell whats left of the sled for parts when your done?


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Oh yes, I'm a preacher of the leakdown test. Will get to it.

Yep, I'll put the sled up on CL this fall. Or if an air cooled Engine pops up cheap, I'll drop it in and sell a runner.

Thanks for the heads up. Will plan on doing all kinds of homework on this powerplant.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 3:13 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:24 pm
Posts: 135
Location: Cincinnati Ohio
I have a 440 fan I will be selling soon......


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:07 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Picked up a single-carb intake with oil pump, carb, and airbox from a 587 for $55. Needs cleaning up but I'll see if I can use all of it, or at least the intake. Sled is at my dad's farm. Will be slow-going since I cleaned my garage and can't destroy it -- house is still for sale. Another offer coming in this week, so hopefully I'll be on my way to a new place with a mega-garage or barn soon. =)

Are these Rotax's fine to convert from oil injection to fuel mix? I haven't read up on lubrication yet. If fine to mix, I'll throw a block-off plate on my list of cnc-plasma parts.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2012 1:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
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Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Here's the single carb Seadoo 580 Rotax intake I got for $55, complete from air box to intake:
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Needs some cleaning, but looks to be pretty sound. Hoping I can solve some problems with the single Mikuni carb, square pump, and air box stack in regards to space, power and thumb stress. Air filter opening is pretty dang small, and def needs a new filter.

Again...can't really dive into this until my Zilla is sold. <sigh>...


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 23, 2012 8:52 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 4:56 pm
Posts: 224
Location: Ontario Canada
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
Are these Rotax's fine to convert from oil injection to fuel mix? .


I did not use the oil injection on my 670. But you need to keep the oil bath for the rotary valve and waterpump drive. I just looped a hose from the oil fittings on the bottm of the cranckcase to the top and filled it with oil.

Image


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 31, 2012 2:15 pm 
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Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Ok. I think I may be bringing home the chassis and the tubing bender back from the farm finally this weekend. Simple since I can chuck it in the back of the pick-up.

With the help of some odds and ends (and a gearbox) from member Nelly, I've got a jump start on assembling this thing from scratch rather than cannibalizing one of my other buggies. The biggest help was a giant bag of misc FL350R nuts and bolts. Huuuuuuge help for a bare-frame-up project.

I know this build thread is a crazy mess of tangents and what not, but it's time to get to this buggy already. :shock: Most of it has been accumulated already. I've been waiting to sell my '88 Zilla to make some room, but it just ins't happening. And my house has been for sale, so I couldn't destroy my garage. Aaaaand been waiting to get my new compressor up and running, and old one sold. Well, Zilla can roll in/out and can fit in my truck when someone wants to see the house; buggy can be covered with a sheet; compressors are running / sold respectively; wife can be overcome with a fall anniversary trip someplace warm and sandy. lol

It is time.

Most recent plans...lol...
1. Stock frame with a couple hoops / braces for front LT and alternative rear; fresh paint; spare tire rack; tree bars; maybe stretched 4-5" in front.
2. LT front with used Fox Air 2.0's (from a Drakart), custom tube a-arms; heims; LT500R brake calipers/discs.
3. Stock rear arms/towers already powder coated, new bearings in, and waiting; stock pilot rear shocks.
4. Stock gearbox (from Nelly). Will open it up, replace input shaft bearing, inspect everything, and close it up.
5. Rotax 467 L/C with E/S. Basic inspection & light overhaul, plus conversion to single carb intake.
6. Honda Civic Racing radiator & fan; overflow bottle from sled
7. Fuel tank...right now it's look like it will be a modified stocker -OR- a spun universal.
8. Seat will be stock unless I get a line on one that will fit right.
9. Tires are brand new Mud Lites 22x11-10 rears and 21-7-10 fronts
10. Rear brake will be same single-rotor, but will try to fit the sportbike caliper I've got; pressure splitter/adjuster.
11. Body panel kit similar to my current buggy
12. Sled gages + EGT + Voltage and maybe a Vapor (again) on a stationary mount (not another steering wheel pod).
13. Custom front bumper
14. Custom electrical harness with stock battery box
15. LED headlamps and rear red running light
16. Front winch
17. Farr pipe (but not sure since I won't be using their Engine mount).


And who knows...maybe when I'm done with this, I'll build one of those SnowZilla machines out of my parts stash. ;)


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 1:43 pm 
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Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
More delays...

I think my house is finally sold. =) And the potential buyer wants 2-weeks possession! That's crazy, but I'll make it happen as soon as they put it in writing. May be living in my in-laws place for a month or so, as well as a storage unit. lol

Selling a crapload of Quadzilla parts. My garage looks like a warehouse!


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 10:18 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Great news! My house is SOLD SOLD SOLD and we put an offer on the new place yesterday with good feedback. The new place boasts a 25x40 pole bar with concrete floors, 200A service, heat, 2-acres of yard surrounded by bean fields...so...I will finally have enough room for my next couple buggy projects, all the tools/parts, and riding. I should be in the new place the w/o Oct 19th. =) I've been busy selling hoards of Quadzilla parts on eBay and CL, the past week or so, too.

Picked up a set of Fox Air 2.0 shocks with 6.5" travel for $140. So the Rotax buggy will be running Pilot rears and Fox Air fronts.


Attachments:
File comment: New barn (who cares about the house, school system, etc...lol)
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:17 am 
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Location: PERTH WESTERN AUSTRALIA
Good for you!
25 x 40 pole barn,all on 2 acres..............plus bonus free house? BLISS! Image


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