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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:18 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
Wiggins sent me a ATC250R top end and complete Engine for CSI and rebuilding here are some of my initial findings as I unbox the parts.

The cylinder is used it appears to be a 85 cylinder.

A few things I noticed right away was rust around the studs (blue), this is normal how ever if you have a cylinder that is not installed you should be soaking the studs with PB Blaster so if they ever need to be removed you have increased your chances of removing them without damage.

Someone used what appears to be white silicone (pink arrow) type sealant on the head gasket, this is a no no, who told anybody to put anyhting on the head gasket surfaces, if your factory service manual tells you to apply sealant to something then ok if it does not don't use a sealer on the head gasket!!!

See what was squeezed into the coolant passages, how much of that is now stuck in your radiator blocking coolant passages or wrapped around the impeller of your water pump, see where it was squeezed to the outside of the head, no doubt it also squeezed into the cylinder, wonder where that went, most would comfort themselves and claim it was harmlessly sent out the exhaust :shock:

The green arrow is pointing towards the aluminum stuck to the cylinder walls from a seizure I have no idea what caused the seizure I simply do not have enough evdivence to work with to determine.

I will remove the aluminum with muriatic acid, give the cylinder a lite hone then measure to see what the bore is and if its straight.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:21 pm 
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Location: Chicago
The head looks stock and ok I will clean it up and cc to see if its stock or not, I will also lap to see if its flat.


The pink arrow is pointing at more of the sealer so I assume this head was mated to the cylinder it came with.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:22 pm 
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Location: Chicago
The top end came with a ram valve the reeds are not seating, I will remove them and check the condition further.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:23 pm 
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Location: Chicago
The inside of the ram valve for those of you that never seen one before


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:24 pm 
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Location: Chicago
Some damage to the gasket surface of the ram valve not sure what happen their, easily fixed with a file.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:52 pm 
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Location: Chicago
Every where I look their is sharp edges where the piston and cylinder meet, these edges need to be rounded over so they do not scrape the oil off the piston when the Engine is running, heck this might be what caused the seizure but again I just don't know enough about this cylinder to say.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
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Location: Chicago
Here is one that really pisses me off to no end once again some skillbilly has used a power tool to clean a aluminum gasket surface, how does he expect it to seal when its no longer FLAT did they actually think taking a ABRASIVE pad hooked to a power tool then put on a SOFT aluminum surface would not damage the surface? People this dumb should not be allowed to own tools LMAO

Some simple advice that applies here... for ever action their is a reaction!

The action here was using a ABRASIVE pad hooked to a power tool

The reaction was now the gasket surface is DAMAGED and no longer FLAT at this point I am not sure of the extent of the damage of if I can straighten it out again the cylinder might have to be machined, a skim cut to true up the surface again.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:02 pm 
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Location: Chicago
You can see in this pic someone attempted to remove the locater dowel in the bottom of the cylinder, I am not sure what they were trying to accomplish looking at how distorted it is I guess they thought the paper thin metal tube would withstand someone gripping it with a pliers and squeezing?

I have seen this act many times here is how I remove the dowels, first if you can soak it as long as possible with PB Blaster.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:04 pm 
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Location: Chicago
First find a bolt that fits tight in the dowel I used a 3/8, then using your best curve jaw visegeips grip the bolt on the threads as tight as you can, being on the threaded part of the bolt adds traction.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:05 pm 
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Location: Chicago
Make sure you leave room between the visegrips and the cylinder so when you turn it ou don't scrape and damage the gasket surface.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:06 pm 
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Location: Chicago
Turn and pull if your lucky it comes out easily, I have had some that don't move and you end up using a dremel and grinding them out, this can take alot of time.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 3:07 pm 
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Location: Chicago
Here it is removed, the bolt is trashed.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 7:49 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:26 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Las Vegas
Hey Hoser,

The guy that did all that wonderful sealing and skillbillyn' is supposedly the 250R guy around here. He has long been off my list of mechanics.

I'd much rather spend the money to send stuff up to you and know it is done correctly.

BTW, that is an '86 cylinder. It's grey. It and the head are original to the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) that I sent ya.


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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 10:31 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22512
Location: Chicago
wiggins wrote:
Hey Hoser,

The guy that did all that wonderful sealing and skillbillyn' is supposedly the 250R guy around here. He has long been off my list of mechanics.

I'd much rather spend the money to send stuff up to you and know it is done correctly.

BTW, that is an '86 cylinder. It's grey. It and the head are original to the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) that I sent ya.


Do you remember what carb and jetting you were running when you squeaked that piston, we will want to richen it up after the rebuild my guess is the mid range (needle) played more of a part than the main, its been my experience when going from hard pack to sand the added load makes the jetting lean (more load requires more fuel) most people spend more time in the midrange than any place else, the exception would be someone on a MX track they would be more WOT (Wide Open Throttle) than mid.


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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2007 10:06 pm 
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Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:26 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Las Vegas
Carb was stock and I'd have to go check the jets but it is not going back on the trike. I have the new pwk 39mm to put on it once you are done w/ the Engine.


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PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2007 10:42 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:31 pm
Posts: 5559
Location: New Jersey
How did the bore size up Hoser?
Wiggins I have alot of 85 parts if you need anything-dunno what year you have there-----


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2007 12:01 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 1:26 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Las Vegas
Mudbogger wrote:
How did the bore size up Hoser?
Wiggins I have alot of 85 parts if you need anything-dunno what year you have there-----


Thanks for the offer . I appreciate it. It's an '86 but '85parts will work.


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 9:06 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:31 pm
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Location: New Jersey
no problem-anytime. :-)


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File comment: heres mine before I got the bug to touch it
85 250R 001.jpg
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