PilotOdyssey.com
http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/

Redoing the after shock a-arm install
http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=3267		 Page 13 of 17
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat May 02, 2009 9:55 am ]
Post subject: 
Here are some pic's of something I discovered... This is why my wheel locks up on me...

Attachments:
File comment: the plate the big hiem goes thru...
bent_tab1_879.jpg
bent_tab1_879.jpg [ 33.69 KiB | Viewed 2856 times ]
File comment: you can see at the top how it folds back...
benttab2_183.jpg
benttab2_183.jpg [ 29.75 KiB | Viewed 2856 times ]
File comment: you can see here how out of squarer it really is... This is why I get so much wheel travel before lockup...
benttab3_149.jpg
benttab3_149.jpg [ 31.07 KiB | Viewed 2856 times ]
Author:  hoser [ Sat May 02, 2009 10:32 am ]
Post subject: 
Turbotexas wrote:
Here are some pic's of something I discovered... This is why my wheel locks up on me...


That steering setup is a joke we been laughing at it since day one, well we laughed until it locked up on you and that other guy causing him to crash and wreck his 350 pretty badly now its a serious issue as we suspected from day one its a dangerous dumb setup, scrap it ( I know easy for me to say) beg andoh to help you build something like he has on his Pilot,,, pull your rig in his front yard blocking all entrances and exits until your steering is FIXED and SAFE!

Well maybe that is going to the extreme but I bet if you asked him real nice lol :-)

Time to get a camera too :shock: those pics are very poor.

I resized your pics to 800x600 hope you don't mind...
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat May 02, 2009 11:15 am ]
Post subject: 
I don't mind the resize... I forgot to do it... I don't think Miss Toby would like the idea of her driveway blocked up... LOL
Author:  hoser [ Sat May 02, 2009 12:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
Turbotexas wrote:
I don't mind the resize... I forgot to do it... I don't think Miss Toby would like the idea of her driveway blocked up... LOL


Just turn on the charm :-)

::-:
Author:  adnoh [ Sat May 02, 2009 1:35 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have more than one entrance and exit. Remember I live in the country on 5. No need to beg either. I will help any way I can. Please remember I have no professional expeience. The kit I built only has about 8 hr on it and 5 with the new set up and is based off a drawing I made on my clip board while waitng for wife to come out of shop in OKC. This means I can blame her for the work. I see no problems yet but not fully tested either. Two wrongs will not make it right. I agree what you have now cause concerns for your and others safty. I also believe the tie rod set up is not the only issue. This is why I would like you to get the numbes for the suspenion calculater to see whats happing as it moves. I use an o-line calc to runs the suspenion thu its cycle giving me the #'s to base decisions on. I then set up and test for real world feed back via the video frame breakdown. I then use a suspion engineering book to adjust. I also use input from a race car driving book to anaylise the feedback video verse the #,s. If I can do it, you surrley you can ( didn't mean to call you surrley) using your driving and handling knowledge base on what you do every day with the rig and trailers. Does the way you shift your load effect the tire weights going on the scales and the feel of the wheel down the highway? Does the weight position and width of the load change the way you take the cornor at which speed? see what I mean. You do this every day with out thinking about it this is what makes you a profesional driver. You do what automaticly what I have to think about. Lightspeed says " your butt that sensitive" Yes when it comes to steering input and nothing happens it will make your you know what pucker. He was tring to tell me something I just had to listen.

Heres a pic of how it started in OKC. That will teach her to go shoping. I whited out the phone numbers of work related personal. This was a page of my office work book I travle with. The work involed to make right is lenghtly and notes must be taken. You do not just bolt up and go. That is what the professional sell and back. Many hours of testing go into such items and You, I and others pay for that testing when purching parts. The ATVR lt kit is a fine example of this. Not trying to talk you out of anything I just want you now what it's going to take to fix. Your on the right path by logging every issue the the effect, keep doing this it's all revelant. Hopfully what you have can be salvaged and other can benifet from it. You now a simple spring change in the rear can effect the way it handle thu the cornor.

I will post up some notes from my folder on front end so you can see what I mean. This folder contains around sixty pages of notes and discussion and the lap top has hundereds of pics and a excell work book with lots of data. Which remindes me I should back up on updates on external drive.

As far as hacking tools go 110 vlot welder, fire extenshier,hacksaw or band saw, grinder,small drill press, drill bits, metal, air compressor, datco (small air grinder), misc sanding pads and meal file. I call this a hacking bench. It all sets on a roll away table with the exception being the air compressior, it set in cornor with hose real. I do most of mine right on drive henc Back yard hacker.

Attachments:
bump kit drawing .jpg
bump kit drawing .jpg [ 60.27 KiB | Viewed 2837 times ]
Note 1.jpg
Note 1.jpg [ 63.83 KiB | Viewed 2837 times ]
Note 2.jpg
Note 2.jpg [ 50.68 KiB | Viewed 2837 times ]
Note 3.jpg
Note 3.jpg [ 61.79 KiB | Viewed 2837 times ]
Note 4.jpg
Note 4.jpg [ 62.38 KiB | Viewed 2837 times ]
Author:  adnoh [ Sat May 02, 2009 1:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here is some discussion note from folder,wookbook and pic of updated bump.

Attachments:
Note 7.jpg
Note 7.jpg [ 58.99 KiB | Viewed 2836 times ]
Note 8.jpg
Note 8.jpg [ 62.04 KiB | Viewed 2836 times ]
Note 9.jpg
Note 9.jpg [ 62.71 KiB | Viewed 2836 times ]
File comment: Reworked flex plate adding bump stop plate and new idler bracket.
Reworked kit, bump stop bracket added and new LR curved bracket.jpg
Reworked kit, bump stop bracket added and new LR curved bracket.jpg [ 76.45 KiB | Viewed 2836 times ]
File comment: New idler bracket. curved down for shear load inpact and line up on bump stop. This takes the shear force from idler to frame and away from steering wheel and inner ball joints.
New LR curved bracket lined up with bump stop hole on bracket.jpg
New LR curved bracket lined up with bump stop hole on bracket.jpg [ 76.34 KiB | Viewed 2836 times ]
Author:  adnoh [ Sat May 02, 2009 2:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
I had to add a bump stop backer plate to the frame. This bracket had to be welded into place. Two reasons.first this still allowed me to bolt up plate and alow the shear force to be transmitted from bracked as it flexed to the frame.

What I did on adjustment was set bump stop bolt to bottom (on new idler with new ratio) just prior to steering stop. This way I use all of the steering wheel where previous I only used 80 % steering wheel to 100% of wheel movment lock to lock. This also allowed it to flex under load using bump stop before hitting the steering stop on colum and keep from transfering feed back to wheel. I do some issue with deflection in material used in bump stop kit. So far I feel it not to be an issue I have found a denser material to use however there may be a trade off from deflection force and move it ot the bump stop and frame mount and brakcket flex.

Attachments:
New bup kit stops and wheel rate with lower CG.jpg
New bup kit stops and wheel rate with lower CG.jpg [ 81.53 KiB | Viewed 2833 times ]
File comment: Frame plates welded to frame. bump stop bracket flexes to frame plate.
Frame plates.jpg
Frame plates.jpg [ 229.33 KiB | Viewed 2691 times ]
Flex backet shear load to frame bracket.jpg
Flex backet shear load to frame bracket.jpg [ 126.97 KiB | Viewed 2691 times ]
Author:  bugeye59 [ Sat May 02, 2009 8:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hey Richie Rich.Those drawings reminded me of my Grade 7 Da Vinci Project/Essay-Life and Times.
Just missing some feathers. :-)
I won sorta, and shared 1st prize with another.
You related?
Leonardo Da Richie?
Leonardo Da Adnoh? :-) Bravo,good work. :-)
Author:  hoser [ Sat May 02, 2009 10:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
adnoh wrote:
I had to add a bump stop backer plate to the frame. This bracket had to be welded into place. Two reasons.first this still allowed me to bolt up plate and alow the shear force to be transmitted from bracked as it flexed to the frame.

What I did on adjustment was set bump stop bolt to bottom (on new idler with new ratio) just prior to steering stop. This way I use all of the steering wheel where previous I only used 80 % steering wheel to 100% of wheel movment lock to lock. This also allowed it to flex under load using bump stop before hitting the steering stop on colum and keep from transfering feed back to wheel. I do some issue with deflection in material used in bump stop kit. So far I feel it not to be an issue I have found a denser material to use however there may be a trade off from deflection force and move it ot the bump stop and frame mount and brakcket flex.


You cant get it to a 100% ratio and just use the factory stops? Even at 80% can you adjust the factory stops (weld something on them) and use it?

The best place to have a stop would be installed at the wheel so any impact force would not have to be transferred through the tie rods to the factory stop it would do the banging out at the wheel?
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat May 02, 2009 10:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
hoser wrote:
adnoh wrote:
I had to add a bump stop backer plate to the frame. This bracket had to be welded into place. Two reasons.first this still allowed me to bolt up plate and alow the shear force to be transmitted from bracked as it flexed to the frame.

What I did on adjustment was set bump stop bolt to bottom (on new idler with new ratio) just prior to steering stop. This way I use all of the steering wheel where previous I only used 80 % steering wheel to 100% of wheel movment lock to lock. This also allowed it to flex under load using bump stop before hitting the steering stop on colum and keep from transfering feed back to wheel. I do some issue with deflection in material used in bump stop kit. So far I feel it not to be an issue I have found a denser material to use however there may be a trade off from deflection force and move it ot the bump stop and frame mount and brakcket flex.


You cant get it to a 100% ratio and just use the factory stops? Even at 80% can you adjust the factory stops (weld something on them) and use it?

The best place to have a stop would be installed at the wheel so any impact force would not have to be transferred through the tie rods to the factory stop it would do the banging out at the wheel?


Remember for now at least we are working with 350 hubs and there stops were on the hub itself to the j-arm...
Author:  mudbogger [ Sun May 03, 2009 8:01 am ]
Post subject: 
Turbo I have complete set of arms if you need them. :-)
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sun May 03, 2009 8:23 am ]
Post subject: 
Mudbogger wrote:
Turbo I have complete set of arms if you need them. :-)


OK Let's trade!!!
Author:  mudbogger [ Sun May 03, 2009 9:04 am ]
Post subject: 
I am sure we can work something out indeed friend-we still have finish up the last trade as I owe you correct?
Have you bolted on that master by chance?
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sun May 03, 2009 9:40 am ]
Post subject: 
Mudbogger wrote:
I am sure we can work something out indeed friend-we still have finish up the last trade as I owe you correct?
Have you bolted on that master by chance?


Hoping to get to that today... Have been with the kid all day yesterday, and his bike was taking priority LOL I might have time today, before I go see the GF... LOL
Author:  adnoh [ Sun May 03, 2009 7:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Thanks Baz, I not only did poorly in math but art as well. I do not know why my hands can't do what my brain tells them. By the way I schelduled some dyno time on temp test know that I did some testing in the sand. I will test theroy of 130 deg verses 200 deg for torgue readings. My max speeds were at around 200 degrees. Should know soon and will post up. Plus I really need to know why Tobey smoked me down the straight with Her stock piped motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )).

Turbo, thinking of a arm change.If so what type. What do yo think about arm rework for caster change. The rework will be easier to adjust than moving ball joint. Just remove upper pivot bolt and change shims. No need to re toe or camber to see effect on caster setting. Thoughts.
Author:  Turbotexas [ Mon May 04, 2009 9:12 am ]
Post subject: 
adnoh wrote:
Thanks Baz, I not only did poorly in math but art as well. I do not know why my hands can't do what my brain tells them. By the way I schelduled some dyno time on temp test know that I did some testing in the sand. I will test theroy of 130 deg verses 200 deg for torgue readings. My max speeds were at around 200 degrees. Should know soon and will post up. Plus I really need to know why Tobey smoked me down the straight with Her stock piped motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )).

Turbo, thinking of a arm change.If so what type. What do yo think about arm rework for caster change. The rework will be easier to adjust than moving ball joint. Just remove upper pivot bolt and change shims. No need to re toe or camber to see effect on caster setting. Thoughts.


OK On further inspection with wheels on I think maybe I do have the castor in this setup... I am not sure of the best way to measure, I used a small piece of angle iron and then placed the magnet angle finder on this. All this was done with out a second set of hands... I believe Mudbogger has a new set of these A-arms he bought from chucklenuts at aftershot motorspurts years ago...
Author:  Turbotexas [ Mon May 04, 2009 9:15 am ]
Post subject: 
I am working on the GF's AC today, then I will replace the Master cylinder next (Thanks Mud) and then I will try to bend the tab back into place. Then I will go home and work on the bracket for the links... All this while hunting loads and working!!!
Author:  hoser [ Sun Jun 21, 2009 2:20 pm ]
Post subject: 
Any updates?
Author:  Turbotexas [ Mon Jun 22, 2009 12:47 am ]
Post subject: 
hoser wrote:
Any updates?


Yea... The GF is history, work is slow and the buggy has been parked since I came back from the race on the 30'th I might have some free time this week after fixing the toyhauler???
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:56 pm ]
Post subject:  What a fence post will do to a rim...
Here are some pictures...
Mud I think I will need some brotherly love on some A-Arms you mentioned!!! The lower one is tweeked pretty bad, and I am not sure if I can get it twisted back to shape! I am afraid this will tweak my Shocks! I have a race next week end and at the end of the month so I am trying to get this done this week! Tomorrow I have to take the top end apart on the 400ex basket case so I know what I need to order!

Attachments:
fencepost damage 001.jpg
fencepost damage 001.jpg [ 42.91 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 002.jpg
fencepost damage 002.jpg [ 49.39 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 003.jpg
fencepost damage 003.jpg [ 37.2 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 004.jpg
fencepost damage 004.jpg [ 43.94 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 005.jpg
fencepost damage 005.jpg [ 72.55 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 006.jpg
fencepost damage 006.jpg [ 74.17 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat Aug 08, 2009 10:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
some more

Attachments:
fencepost damage 007.jpg
fencepost damage 007.jpg [ 44.86 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 008.jpg
fencepost damage 008.jpg [ 36.49 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
fencepost damage 009.jpg
fencepost damage 009.jpg [ 50.85 KiB | Viewed 2820 times ]
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I can get everything buttoned up in time I plan on trying the 400 ex spindles and wheels on this while the top end is being honed etc...
Author:  redman [ Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Damage
Is your front spindle cracked in the last pic just above the R or is it just an illusion?
Redman
Author:  Turbotexas [ Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Damage
redman wrote:
Is your front spindle cracked in the last pic just above the R or is it just an illusion?
Redman


I see where you are talking about, the upper right corner? I will look tomorrow...
Author:  redman [ Sun Aug 09, 2009 9:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Damage
Turbotexas wrote:
redman wrote:
Is your front spindle cracked in the last pic just above the R or is it just an illusion?
Redman


I see where you are talking about, the upper right corner? I will look tomorrow...



Actually it's right in the center of the hub...See the R on the hub in the pic? Now look just above it...It runs horizontal...
Redman
Page 13 of 17 All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
https://www.phpbb.com/