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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:17 pm
Posts: 2838
Location: Wichita ks
Yes the black plastic thing is in upside down that is spring spacer slider install upside down the right shock transitin to the tender spring sooner then the other side. The Al colour is up and slider down. This is why it took off funny as the spring compressed it transitioned sooner on the right side getting stiffer and tossing it left side down as it unloaded. Told you I was an Idot. I 'll blame the red and white ,will that get me off the hook.This also will cause kick on entry into woops bieing to stiff to soon and slam the right side left and make you feeel like it packing. I knew it was not the take off ramp I jumped the wifes and 450 to make sure.

I fixed it and adjusted the transition spacer + .1475 and + 8 clikes on rebound ready for test tommorow. Was fun thu wasent it finding the OOPS. I hope every one got a good laugh out of it I know I did after wife gave me the look. Once dialed in tommorw I will try double if right Yes my freind will be to shoot video.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 21, 2008 8:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:17 pm
Posts: 2838
Location: Wichita ks
I bet some can can add arrows to pic for easy explation I cant get it to work.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 1:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:17 pm
Posts: 2838
Location: Wichita ks
Arrow test. Here Turbo I think I have it. I like learing new stuff.


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OOPS comparison.jpg
OOPS comparison.jpg [ 145.98 KiB | Viewed 171 times ]
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 3:22 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 2:17 pm
Posts: 2838
Location: Wichita ks
Did some more testing on set up yesterday. Friend came over to help and we dialed his in as well. What advantage I had is gone now since We dialed in in shocks. First I would like to dicuss spring rate since I felt ther were off The springs are a staraight rate( linier springs). This means that a single rate shock with a 200 lb rated spring takes 200 lb of force to move one inch. This example will come in handy later. A dual rate shock will have a combanation of springs A tender and a main sspring, combinting the two to get rate. Example is two 200 lb spring is 400 lb spring rate. So if the 400 lb rate moved 1" it would take 200 force pounds. This is because each 200 pound moved 1/2 " which take 100 lbs of force. See the corlation. this will come inhady later when calculating the transition rate at a given point in shaft travle. Rember I made a tran sition adjustment. This changes the shaft travle lenght onto the main sping Poundage rate. This should smooth out the progresson. These are refered to as external adjustments. the two adjustments are prelaod and transition spacer adjustments each effect spring poundage. First is preload.

How do we figure preload (sag)poundage. This is the amount of spring poundage at ride height. If you make a ride height adjustment it effect the poundage of the spring at that shaft lenght. This is called static load. It's easy to figue and This is how. I will use my dual rate rear sice this is my issue. I have a 450 llb main and a 200 lb tender. Must will say what but be paintance. Rember thes are a different set up than what you norminaly see but the basics are the same. So lets measure up the spring stack. This is the measure ments of the two springs on top of each other. In my case this is 16.25 inches. So i assembly the springs on bodys ( hpoefully right this time)and set the pre load spners at 16.25 inspring lenght. so the static load is 0 ( zero). Rember I posted setting up shock at Zero (netural) for base line #'s and will work from there this is one step in the process. I f I was to turn down the preload spanners so that the spring stack is 16" the staitic load would be ? hers the math. 16.25 - 16 = .25,650 lb ( spring rate) x .25 = 162.50 lbs of static load. Bet you did not think 1/4" would yeild that. The point don't start cranking down untill you now what the effect would be. What do you think that did to your ride height. Lets get back to my zero staic setting to see. I first must find out what Zero static load set my ride height at. Put on shocks set at zero and add 180 lbs in seat bounceand roll then measure up. I know I have 12.5 " in rear and the new sag meaurement came out at 2.5 inches. That at 20% sag. See the Issue yet.

The issue is the most sag available for the 650 poundage is 20 % Good ,bad, ok ? let find out. Issues I had kick at entry and odd take off. What does prlaod and transition have to do with it? Poundage? Odd take off was an Idiot putting on spring stack to body. That has been changed. It now takes off square with other issues, touch on them latter. Lets talk spring rates using dual rate set up. Thetender spring will provide a smooth ride over small bump and obstructions( deep tracks in sand) and allow a lower ride height at a given static load. An example in my case would be a light tender would allow for more sag. The main spring is there to take over once it tender spring has hit the transition spacer. The spacer adjustment controls the amount of poundage at a given shaft lenght before transitiong to the main spring which is a higher poundage for the rest of the shaft lenght before bottoming. This settingis used for g- outs, woops and jump were harsh bottoming occures. If it kicks on entry a slower transition will let it stay on softer spring sooner if its not bottoming out the shaft. How to determin. Put some grease on shaftand hit the woops. then look to see how much the shaft was wipe with grease. Take this shaft measurment of poundage equation later. If only half of the travle was used its coming onto the main to soon and kicking. Rember were talikng about external adjustment not internal high,low and rebound clickers.

This is why I made the adjustment on transition spacer and not pre load. don't guess and never ever use a ride height( preload) adjustment to cure bottoming and body role. If the shaft travle bottomened then I would transition to main sooner if not yo go the other way. If you go the other way it does not help then a sprnig change is in order to a stiffer greater combanatin of poundage. If your asking your self why the woops and not big air. The amount of force applied to springs thu the woops is greater than a jump. I proved this by setting transition sapcer and hitting woops adjusting to it hit bottom thu woops than hit a set of jump at a time measuring amount of stroke used untill all were hit and measured. A 12" to 24" foot deep set of woops used all the spring poundage and the four to five foot jumps only used 70 % of the shock stroke. Now that the transition spacer is set it time to test body role and adjust the transition to cornor( changing bias front to rear) properly then back up and set high speed clicker to compasate for body role transition adjustment. Once it turns and walkes thu woops then set low speed final adjustment for cornoring according to conditions and what do you know the kick is gone and all the travle is now being used. I went from 6 inch of travle being used to 12.5 and the speed thu also increased due to control and traction as well as a non harsh landing.

I will chart and gragh for viewing poundage thu stroke with the varible being static load and transition spacer location. Yes I may look into changing rates for increased sag after test at dunes to see if these can not be set to be used. The thing about incresed sag is the effect GC has on CG changing the handling and trasition rate.


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