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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 6:03 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
I understand your jets are clear, but are the air passages feeding the idle circuit open?

Crank case leaks cause a lean condition in a 2 stroke, not a rich condition which is what your plug is showing.

When you are having to hold the throttle slide open, this is an indication that the air fuel mix is needing more air which it is not getting from the idle circuit.

When there is a seal leak, the plugs will be a light tan in color. This condition will burn up an Engine quickly.

You may have a weak ignition problem.

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:41 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
Randman wrote:
I understand your jets are clear, but are the air passages feeding the idle circuit open?

Crank case leaks cause a lean condition in a 2 stroke, not a rich condition which is what your plug is showing.

When you are having to hold the throttle slide open, this is an indication that the air fuel mix is needing more air which it is not getting from the idle circuit.

When there is a seal leak, the plugs will be a light tan in color. This condition will burn up an Engine quickly.

You may have a weak ignition problem.

Rand


Ok now that makes more sense.
How do I check the ignition system?
Could my timing be off? That's what caused the lean condition in my 90 but that's a 4 stroke.

Are the air passages shown in the Manuel?


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:33 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
No, the passages in the carb are not defined. You will see in the bottom of the intake opening of the carb a small air passage, make sure it is clear. If memory serves me right, there is also a small passage just either in front of the slide or under the slide. Its been a while since I've played with a 250 carb so I might be wrong. The important thing with these carbs is to make sure all of the passages are clear, if not it will not idle properly.

As far as timing goes, yes it could be off. I believe by the looks of your Ody it has a solid state ignition and not points like the early 250s but like I don't remember what year they went from points to solid state ignition.

Download and read the manual about how to test the ignition and set the timing.

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:46 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
Ok I'll check later and post a pic.
And yes I have a CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) set up.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
Ok im just going to give up for a while. Tried to pull the fly wheel and screwed up the treads. so now i have another problem.
Im going to wait on my order to come in and go from there. This sucks


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:47 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
Redheadedjosh wrote:
Ok im just going to give up for a while. Tried to pull the fly wheel and screwed up the treads. so now i have another problem.
Im going to wait on my order to come in and go from there. This sucks


Welcome to the world of screwing with Vintage 2 Strokes!

Don't give up, you'll get it!

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:11 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
ok passed all that just working on the crank and inspecting all the bearings.
They all look good and feel tight.

bought the clymer manuel and its pretty good.
gottA get the seals and put back together!


Attachments:
File comment: Got the clutch off with the puller kinda on good.
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File comment: look at the dent from my vw!
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IMG_3284.jpg [ 51.5 KiB | Viewed 846 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:57 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
I bought a 20 ton shop press from harbor freight. Almost done putting the Engine back together.


Attachments:
File comment: Got the motor (( Internal Combustion Engine ? )) back together
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File comment: Fuel filter on and everything is ready for the Engine to be put back on.
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IMG_3382.jpg [ 33.59 KiB | Viewed 833 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:29 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Just make sure to use the freezer and oven as needed to make the job simple for the bearings, cases, and crank. Don't go cracking cases with a shop press! Been there, done that and it sucks.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 2:03 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
Just make sure to use the freezer and oven as needed to make the job simple for the bearings, cases, and crank. Don't go cracking cases with a shop press! Been there, done that and it sucks.


Can I just press in the seal?

How hard is it to press the bearing in and do you have any tips ?


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:22 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
You freeze the bearing and it will contract and heat the case and it will expand. With the difference in size between the two while heated and frozen, the bearing will fall right in, no pressing required.

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 3:25 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 10:02 am
Posts: 2865
Location: East Peoria IL
Put the seal in after the bearings - you do not want to heat the seals. seals should be driven in with a seal driver.


http://www.harborfreight.com/18-piece-s ... 35555.html


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:30 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
Update , I got the Engine back in. It runs. But it very very hard to start. Had to take the air filter off for it to crank. But when it runs I put it in and she ran fine. I ran her for a while and could not restart her, after I let it cool back to room temp. The plug was carbon fouled pretty good.
It won't crank with a new plug and haven tried to take that air filter off.

So what should I do to try to correct this problem ???!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:01 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Did you do a leakdown test and a compresison check after you had the Engine all together?

Stock jetting? Stock airbox w/ lid? 32:1 fuel/oil mix?


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
No leak down test. don't have the stuff for it. It running too rich, not too lean so i don't see why that would be a problem. It does run its just hard to start. and carbon fouls the plug.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:07 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
Did you do a leakdown test and a compresison check after you had the Engine all together?

Stock jetting? Stock airbox w/ lid? 32:1 fuel/oil mix?


Yes stock jetting but has had a rebuild kit. stock airbox with lid a little bent up and running 30:1 yamalube mix


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 5:14 am
Posts: 214
couple of things: did you check the backslap on your reduction box chain? sorry to be a PITA but it looks like it could be close to touching the case.
all of that carbon on top of the piston should come of before you run it, and it is caused by incorrect fuel/air ratio (i believe) is your air filter clean and oiled?
depending on how bad the threads on the shaft are, you may be able to get them ok with a thread file, also your woodruf key might be buggered making it real hard to get the flywheel off


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:42 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
turbo wrote:
couple of things: did you check the backslap on your reduction box chain? sorry to be a PITA but it looks like it could be close to touching the case.
all of that carbon on top of the piston should come of before you run it, and it is caused by incorrect fuel/air ratio (i believe) is your air filter clean and oiled?
depending on how bad the threads on the shaft are, you may be able to get them ok with a thread file, also your woodruf key might be buggered making it real hard to get the flywheel off


That's all dune. Everything is good.
I just can't get her to crank right.


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:23 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 5:14 am
Posts: 214
spark plug gap ok


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:26 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 5:14 am
Posts: 214
nice machine btw


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 9:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2010 5:14 am
Posts: 214
if your losing spark have a look at the wires at the back of the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) harness plug, the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) is sealed so probably not getting gas in it


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 Post subject: Re: Honda FL250 project
PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 1:13 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:13 am
Posts: 38
Location: Gulf coast Alabama
turbo wrote:
if your losing spark have a look at the wires at the back of the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) harness plug, the CDI (Capacitor Discharge Ignition) is sealed so probably not getting gas in it


Yea man everything like that works she is just really hard to start? I have no idea why.


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