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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:48 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
B S wrote:
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
$1500

That's an good price especially for up here


There is another one posted here right now in running condition for $2200 or trade:
http://redding.craigslist.org/bar/3558814067.html
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:52 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Randman wrote:
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
Randman wrote:
Doesn't sound like the starter is spinning fast enough to thrown the drive gears into the fly wheel.

What happens to these starters is that the armature and all of the brushes slowly get coated in oil because of the way the counter balance vent is configured. The vent is on the stator side of the Engine's bottom end and the oil that travels through the vent is flung onto the flywheel and starter gear and then directly into the starter. When this happens, the starter will start to slow down until it either does what your is doing or it will completely quit all together.

Starter is probably full of oil.....I'd bet money on it! A sure way to tell is to remove the pull starter cover and look to see how much oil is in there. The teeth of the starter gears are normally dry but they will be coated in dirty oil because of this design flaw.

Rand


Rand, Hey I really appreciate this tip. Tonight we are taking the starter off for a closer inspection.
So once the starter is full of oil can you normally just drain it out or do I need to tear the starter itself apart to clear all the residual oil off the brushes and everything?


You'll need to tear the starter down and do a rebuild or purchase a new starter. I have tried to just clean them up but they generally need a rebuild kit. You can find rebuild kits on ebay for around 30 bucks.

Don't forget you will need to do the modification to the vent system to prevent it from happening again.

Rand


Thanks again for the tip, I will go check for the vent mod tonight also.
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B S
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:45 pm
Posts: 3610
Location: CHICO,CA
yeah my opinion that was a little high for 22 but I already got 3 so I don't need anymore
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:35 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Randman wrote:
Don't forget you will need to do the modification to the vent system to prevent it from happening again.
Rand


So after reading the thread on the vent mod I went and ordered one of these drain plugs to make the custom oil cap: http://www.amazon.com/Dorman-61127-HELP ... ator+drain

and one of these fuel filters for the breather end:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000C9 ... PDKIKX0DER

Did you use 1/4" or 5/16" gas line?
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B S
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:38 pm 
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Posts: 3610
Location: CHICO,CA
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
Randman wrote:
Don't forget you will need to do the modification to the vent system to prevent it from happening again.
Rand


So after reading the thread on the vent mod I went and ordered one of these drain plugs to make the custom oil cap: http://www.amazon.com/Dorman-61127-HELP ... ator+drain" ."..

and one of these fuel filters for the breather end:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000C9 ... PDKIKX0DER" ."..

Did you use 1/4" or 5/16" gas line?

I used 1/4
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:40 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
Randman wrote:
Don't forget you will need to do the modification to the vent system to prevent it from happening again.
Rand


So after reading the thread on the vent mod I went and ordered one of these drain plugs to make the custom oil cap: http://www.amazon.com/Dorman-61127-HELP ... ator+drain" ."..

and one of these fuel filters for the breather end:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000C9 ... PDKIKX0DER" ."..

Did you use 1/4" or 5/16" gas line?


Aw just saw your post where you threaded the cap instead... good idea but I will probably just use the first option and ram the tube down in the hole with some epoxy.
Still wondering if that is 1/4" or 5/16" tubing in those pictures?
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 3:40 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:19 am
Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
B S wrote:
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
Randman wrote:
Don't forget you will need to do the modification to the vent system to prevent it from happening again.
Rand


So after reading the thread on the vent mod I went and ordered one of these drain plugs to make the custom oil cap: http://www.amazon.com/Dorman-61127-HELP ... ator+drain" .".." ."..

and one of these fuel filters for the breather end:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000C9 ... PDKIKX0DER" .".." ."..

Did you use 1/4" or 5/16" gas line?

I used 1/4


Thank you.
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Randman
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:01 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
Do not use the fuel filter with an open end! This will leave the system open and will allow oil to travel up the hose and starve the ballancer area of its oil!

You want to run a closed system with an expandable bellow on the end. Since the site got hacked all of my pictures are gone and you can't see what I did as the final version. I need to re-post my final version.

Rand
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:03 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Randman wrote:
Do not use the fuel filter with an open end! This will leave the system open and will allow oil to travel up the hose and starve the ballancer area of its oil!

You want to run a closed system with an expandable bellow on the end. Since the site got hacked all of my pictures are gone and you can't see what I did as the final version. I need to re-post my final version.

Rand

I did see the bellow you used, I didn't realize there was a major problem with running the fuel filter instead so thanks for pointing that out.
I will order myself a bellow to use instead, thanks for the tip.
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B S
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:26 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:45 pm
Posts: 3610
Location: CHICO,CA
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
Randman wrote:
Do not use the fuel filter with an open end! This will leave the system open and will allow oil to travel up the hose and starve the ballancer area of its oil!

You want to run a closed system with an expandable bellow on the end. Since the site got hacked all of my pictures are gone and you can't see what I did as the final version. I need to re-post my final version.

Rand

I did see the bellow you used, I didn't realize there was a major problem with running the fuel filter instead so thanks for pointing that out.
I will order myself a bellow to use instead, thanks for the tip.
http://pages.ebay.com/motors/link/?nav=item.view&id=400380966760
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Randman
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 4:31 pm 
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Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
I don't know if I would use that one BS. You need to get a bellows that will allow for some expansion. The one I used with the best result was a bellow from a Can Am outlander 500.

Don't like the white color as it gets dirty quick but they expand well and do the job just fine! Here is a link to one.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Can-Am-ATV-06-1 ... es&vxp=mtr

Rand
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:16 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:19 am
Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Randman wrote:
I don't know if I would use that one BS. You need to get a bellows that will allow for some expansion. The one I used with the best result was a bellow from a Can Am outlander 500.

Don't like the white color as it gets dirty quick but they expand well and do the job just fine! Here is a link to one.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Can-Am-ATV-06-1 ... es&vxp=mtr" ."..

Rand


Thanks guys I just ordered the white one to be on the safe side.

Rand, In your post from 2009 I saw you had linked to the PSC-VB01 that BS just linked to on ebay. I'm just curious, did you happen to try that one out and have it fill up on you like a balloon?
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Randman
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:20 pm 
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Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
No, the ones I tried previously, didn't expand enough so I switched to the Can Am 500 outlander bellow.....I discovered it because my neighbor owns one.

Rand
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:40 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:19 am
Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Randman wrote:
No, the ones I tried previously, didn't expand enough so I switched to the Can Am 500 outlander bellow.....I discovered it because my neighbor owns one.

Rand


Rand, Thanks for the tip I have one on the way now. The white color doesn't bother me too much because I am considering mounting it inside of a vented black plastic PVC pipe housing just to protect it from the elements and allow for easier mounting.
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toby
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:45 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:47 pm
Posts: 156
You can also do the breather mod by putting a brass fitting in the clutch side cover.... If you use the oil dipstick hole, oil will be flung off of the

gears and filling your vent hose full of oil.... Also you loose your dipstick... Here is a couple pics of the mod.....

If you want, Tomorrow I will give you the fitting sizes and the exact location to drill the hole in the side cover..... Dune Dart


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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 6:55 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
toby wrote:
You can also do the breather mod by putting a brass fitting in the clutch side cover.... If you use the oil dipstick hole, oil will be flung off of the

gears and filling your vent hose full of oil.... Also you loose your dipstick... Here is a couple pics of the mod.....

If you want, Tomorrow I will give you the fitting sizes and the exact location to drill the hole in the side cover..... Dune Dart


Nice I saw that before but wasn't sure I was comfortable tapping into my case but am considering it now.
Do you use a bellow like Rand or just a fuel filter?
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:17 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Since I am waiting on parts now I am going to try and just rig a cheap cord for the pull starter tonight so I can at least get the compression test done and let my buddy hear it run before we take her apart for paint and suspension work.
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toby
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:47 pm
Posts: 156
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
toby wrote:
You can also do the breather mod by putting a brass fitting in the clutch side cover.... If you use the oil dipstick hole, oil will be flung off of the

gears and filling your vent hose full of oil.... Also you loose your dipstick... Here is a couple pics of the mod.....

If you want, Tomorrow I will give you the fitting sizes and the exact location to drill the hole in the side cover..... Dune Dart


Nice I saw that before but wasn't sure I was comfortable tapping into my case but am considering it now.
Do you use a bellow like Rand or just a fuel filter?


It's really simple to do, I can give you the tap size and fitting sizes tommorow and instructions, I have it all written down at home...

You use the bellows like Rand.... Dune Dart


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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:21 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:19 am
Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
toby wrote:
You can also do the breather mod by putting a brass fitting in the clutch side cover.... If you use the oil dipstick hole, oil will be flung off of the

gears and filling your vent hose full of oil.... Also you loose your dipstick... Here is a couple pics of the mod.....

If you want, Tomorrow I will give you the fitting sizes and the exact location to drill the hole in the side cover..... Dune Dart



Dune Dart, is that a temperature gauge sensor on your exhaust?
What kind if you don't mind me asking?
I would like to have something like this on my setup.
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:22 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 2:19 am
Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
toby wrote:
SomeGuyFromCali wrote:
toby wrote:
You can also do the breather mod by putting a brass fitting in the clutch side cover.... If you use the oil dipstick hole, oil will be flung off of the

gears and filling your vent hose full of oil.... Also you loose your dipstick... Here is a couple pics of the mod.....

If you want, Tomorrow I will give you the fitting sizes and the exact location to drill the hole in the side cover..... Dune Dart


Nice I saw that before but wasn't sure I was comfortable tapping into my case but am considering it now.
Do you use a bellow like Rand or just a fuel filter?


It's really simple to do, I can give you the tap size and fitting sizes tommorow and instructions, I have it all written down at home...

You use the bellows like Rand.... Dune Dart


Awesome! Yes please send me the details when you can. Thanks!!
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toby
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:35 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 1:47 pm
Posts: 156
It's a Digatron EGT Gauge..... It will read exhaust gas temps, RPM, and also I have It hooked up to read coolant temp on the radiator....

Dune Dart
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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 7:58 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
What kind of lubes are you guys using for the Engine balancer and tranny?
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Randman
PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:31 pm 
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Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
Good ole 10W-40!

Don't forget if you drill and tap the side of the case, you have to modify the belt cover for the hose to clear.

As far as the oil being slung into the fitting when it is on the top of the case, it doesn't matter because the air inside the case expands very slowly and has little chance of traveling up the hose on a closed system with a bellows.

As Dune Dart did point out with my no case modification, you do not have the dip stick in the hole to check any time you want. The hose assembly needs to be removed and then the dip stick placed into the hole to check the oil level.

Rand
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Fatcat
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:34 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:35 am
Posts: 2010
Location: Ottawa, IL
Randman wrote:
Good ole 10W-40!

Don't forget if you drill and tap the side of the case, you have to modify the belt cover for the hose to clear.

As far as the oil being slung into the fitting when it is on the top of the case, it doesn't matter because the air inside the case expands very slowly and has little chance of traveling up the hose on a closed system with a bellows.

As Dune Dart did point out with my no case modification, you do not have the dip stick in the hole to check any time you want. The hose assembly needs to be removed and then the dip stick placed into the hole to check the oil level.

Rand


That way works good Rand. I just keep the dipstick in the toolbox. Mine came with a brass fitting. If you go this route make sure its at a 90 and you won't need any tools. Just us the hose barb as a lever to remove it.


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SomeGuyFromCali
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:01 pm 
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Posts: 345
Location: Redding, Northern California
Fatcat wrote:
Randman wrote:
Good ole 10W-40!

Don't forget if you drill and tap the side of the case, you have to modify the belt cover for the hose to clear.

As far as the oil being slung into the fitting when it is on the top of the case, it doesn't matter because the air inside the case expands very slowly and has little chance of traveling up the hose on a closed system with a bellows.

As Dune Dart did point out with my no case modification, you do not have the dip stick in the hole to check any time you want. The hose assembly needs to be removed and then the dip stick placed into the hole to check the oil level.

Rand


That way works good Rand. I just keep the dipstick in the toolbox. Mine came with a brass fitting. If you go this route make sure its at a 90 and you won't need any tools. Just us the hose barb as a lever to remove it.


Fatcat, is your mod using the stock oil fill cap/dipstick with the 90 degree brass fitting? Sorta hard to tell in that picture.

What did you guys use to block off the original breather hole inside? Weld?
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