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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:39 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2657
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
cruz_01 wrote:
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
stix wrote:
That gear jammer is a cool "toy"! The mechanical seal can still be purchased from Honda for about $30. Do some searching here and you will find the part number (Note: not the FL400 mech seal part number). When the mech seal was readily available, Randy used to replace it when doing a bottom end. I just had a top and bottom done and then oops,after a few hours it began to leak so I say get that new seal installed, also get the mechanical seal's oil seal as well. Its still available too.



Where has the "gear jammer tool" been all my life???? Ordered. Awesome. And THANK YOU! :-)


Worked pretty well loosening the big nut to the sprocket. Although, there is a youtube of a guy using the same tool on a CR500 bike and snapped the tool. Who's to say the guy was doing something wrong but he did break it.



Will make checking/changing my Zillas' wet side main seal muuuuch easier. :-)


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 4:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
Let the building begin!


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 11:07 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:59 am
Posts: 778
cruz_01 wrote:
Let the building begin!


I always love getting new parts ready for install:()
Well on your way to success sir!


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 12:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
So, I'm finally getting back to putting this Engine together. I froze the crank bearing overnight and after they were ice cold I put the cases in the oven at 200 degrees for 20 minutes. Bearings dropped right in.

After a week, it was time to assemble the lower end. I froze each case with the bearing in it overnight. Then I torched the end of the crank for a few minutes and pressed the crank in the cases using the puller I made. The crank pressed in much easier this time with the crank being hot and bearing being frozen.

Now I'm working on grinding the starter housing so I have clearance between the starter and cylinder.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 3:29 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:59 am
Posts: 778
cruz_01 wrote:
So, I'm finally getting back to putting this Engine together. I froze the crank bearing overnight and after they were ice cold I put the cases in the oven at 200 degrees for 20 minutes. Bearings dropped right in.

After a week, it was time to assemble the lower end. I froze each case with the bearing in it overnight. Then I torched the end of the crank for a few minutes and pressed the crank in the cases using the puller I made. The crank pressed in much easier this time with the crank being hot and bearing being frozen.

Now I'm working on grinding the starter housing so I have clearance between the starter and cylinder.



Looking good sir!
The crank looks more like a 350 crank than a pilot crank, Is it different?


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
I hope it's a 400 crank. I'm pretty sure it is because the splines on the magneto side of the crank are specific to a pilot Engine.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:18 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:19 pm
Posts: 2245
Location: Chandler, AZ
Someone definitely machined that crank probably to lighten the rotating weight. The oem crank is completely round and that one is clipped by the pin.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
afastcar wrote:
Someone definitely machined that crank probably to lighten the rotating weight. The oem crank is completely round and that one is clipped by the pin.


What's the reasoning to lighten the crank? Does it hinder reliability? I had it checked for balance and it's spot on with a new rod and lower bearing.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:34 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:48 pm
Posts: 464
A lightened crank assembly lets the Engine rev quicker, faster throttle response. It works best when the rod and piston are also light. Heavy road and piston assembly can negate gains from the lightened crank.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 1:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2657
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
Ha, nice use of that cloth diaper!! Those things make awesome shop rags!! We used them as "burp cloths" for our kids. As soon as my son was off the baby bottles and didn't need a burp cloth anymore, I reallocated all of our "cloths" to the shop...even the yellow, blue, purple and pinks ones, lol.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:19 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
Haha. that's histerical you noticed the cloth diaper. I didn't notice I was using one till you mentioned it.
Yeah my wife attempted to cloth diaper with our first one till she gave up with it and ruined my washing machine.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2015 8:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:31 pm
Posts: 5540
Location: New Jersey
I like that install tool, Hoser made me one that is very similar in fact, they work really well indeed.If I may ask can you take a picture of the cases where the studs thread into? I ask due to mine are not welded on the bottom, meaning you can actually see the studs themselves, which I can't see being the correct way to modify the cases for the top end. Thanks in advance!


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2015 9:35 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
Mudbogger wrote:
I like that install tool, Hoser made me one that is very similar in fact, they work really well indeed.If I may ask can you take a picture of the cases where the studs thread into? I ask due to mine are not welded on the bottom, meaning you can actually see the studs themselves, which I can't see being the correct way to modify the cases for the top end. Thanks in advance!


I'll get some pics over to you tonight Mud. I didn't remember seeing any welding done where the studs thread into the cases. Are the studs expose to be welded to the cases? The only welding done on the clutch side case is above the area where the crank comes out of the case. I assume that was done to reinforce the case where excess shaving was done to match the porting to the 500 jug.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2015 10:25 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:31 pm
Posts: 5540
Location: New Jersey
cruz_01 wrote:
Mudbogger wrote:
I like that install tool, Hoser made me one that is very similar in fact, they work really well indeed.If I may ask can you take a picture of the cases where the studs thread into? I ask due to mine are not welded on the bottom, meaning you can actually see the studs themselves, which I can't see being the correct way to modify the cases for the top end. Thanks in advance!


I'll get some pics over to you tonight Mud. I didn't remember seeing any welding done where the studs thread into the cases. Are the studs expose to be welded to the cases? The only welding done on the clutch side case is above the area where the crank comes out of the case. I assume that was done to reinforce the case where excess shaving was done to match the porting to the 500 jug.


Thanks, I would love to see the mod on your cases to compare. Whats the psi on compression cold on that Engine please. I wish to use to compare to my readings as I have not a clue for my Engine.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2015 11:30 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
Mudbogger wrote:
cruz_01 wrote:
Mudbogger wrote:
I like that install tool, Hoser made me one that is very similar in fact, they work really well indeed.If I may ask can you take a picture of the cases where the studs thread into? I ask due to mine are not welded on the bottom, meaning you can actually see the studs themselves, which I can't see being the correct way to modify the cases for the top end. Thanks in advance!


I'll get some pics over to you tonight Mud. I didn't remember seeing any welding done where the studs thread into the cases. Are the studs expose to be welded to the cases? The only welding done on the clutch side case is above the area where the crank comes out of the case. I assume that was done to reinforce the case where excess shaving was done to match the porting to the 500 jug.


Thanks, I would love to see the mod on your cases to compare. Whats the psi on compression cold on that Engine please. I wish to use to compare to my readings as I have not a clue for my Engine.



Attached are pics of the case from clutch side Mud. Doesn't appear the stud mounts were reinforced but the port side of the case was. Can't understand why you have a chunk of the case missing where the stud goes. Haven't finished Engine yet so can't give you numbers on compression.

I also attached a pic of the starter housing being grinded down for cylinder intake clearance.

Don't know if this has been a problem for other's building a low end pilot Engine but I had a hell of a time getting the counter balance shaft end to align with the supporting bearing on clutch side crank case. I had to freeze the bearing housing and torch the tip of the counter shaft so it go in somewhat smoothly. Smashed my finger with a mallet during this pain in the ass process...


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 1:16 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
Update:

Finally had some spare time work on the CR500 project. I finally have an air leaked tested Engine almost ready to be dropped in!! I'm glad I checked for air leaks before I dropped in the Engine because I had a leak between the intake manifold and reed valve...


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:54 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 8:59 am
Posts: 778
Cruz, make sure you put the clutch on as the backside of the clutch and cylinder need to be ground down to clear each other. It will be much easier now, rather then when the Engine is installed.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 9:14 pm
Posts: 1446
Location: Ma
cruz_01 wrote:
Update:

Finally had some spare time work on the CR500 project. I finally have an air leaked tested Engine almost ready to be dropped in!! I'm glad I checked for air leaks before I dropped in the Engine because I had a leak between the intake manifold and reed valve...


Sexy!


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 7:19 pm
Posts: 2245
Location: Chandler, AZ
Are you running a electric fuel pump? I don't see the fitting in the jug for the pulse tube.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2016 6:05 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 12:39 am
Posts: 3177
Location: Oklahoma City, OK
Pilot bird wrote:
Cruz, make sure you put the clutch on as the backside of the clutch and cylinder need to be ground down to clear each other. It will be much easier now, rather then when the Engine is installed.

I had my shop turn the back side of the clutch face on a lathe and I used a dremil tool to knock a little off the jug to get it to clear. This has to be done on the 102c and the powerblok. Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:12 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 1:18 am
Posts: 627
Location: Los Angeles
afastcar wrote:
Are you running a electric fuel pump? I don't see the fitting in the jug for the pulse tube.


The pulse fitting is on the other side of the cylinder. Ha.. That would of sucked installing the Engine with no place to connect the pulse hose to!!

As far as the clutch goes, I'm going to have some material removed from the clutch and dremel whatever I need from the cylinder. I have a buddy who is a machinist for Rocketdyne/Aerojet. He can use one of their top secret lathes to care of the clutch :shock:

I'm going to use the powerbloc clutch for this Engine that I'm currently running now in the pilot.


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 Post subject: Re: CR500 Build
PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2016 1:21 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2010 12:02 am
Posts: 2014
Location: St. John, Washington
Cr500 too ends is how the pilot should have come stock! Would have made more sense to me for Honda to use castings they already had and have a bit more powa! But what do I know;)

Good work though. Should be an awesome machine!


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