OK, I did a search and could not locate anything, Im asking what springs are you guys with LT pilots are running, here is what I know so far
Halo's car setup by Dave-Co has 14" coilovers Bottom spring is 14" 100# top is 14" 80"
Farr's bolt on kit uses 12" Fox and suggested springs are Bottom 14" 150" top 12" 100#

I bought a Farr bolt on rear, waiting for it's arrival, I bought shocks but spring rates have quite a span, but maybe the difference is the amount of preload from one to the other? I think I asked this before, sorry it's my ailment, I have CRS.

33 views and no replies already, there must be more folks lurking around than we thought
with making this post I was able to locate an old thread or 2 about the same subject.
http://www.pilotodyssey.com/PO/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8800

So were you able to get what you were looking for?

Got some ideas but there is still a gap, I'd like to know a little more info like how they are working, seems the 125 over 150 is what ATVR is putting on and reports are too stiff, would be nice to know spring lengths and how much preload and sag, I'm figuring roughly 500# in the rear for loaded weight distribution, if 100 over 150 the result would be 75#/inch knock off approx. 100# for the wheel, a arm and other hardware, so now were at 125# per side so with no preload on the springs the sag would be just under 2 inches, if my thinking is correct that just does not seem like that's where it should be.
so looking for more input, I may be off on my calculations or maybe on the pilot we want it to sit up so there is more travel for initial hit.
Would like as much input as I can get, also this thread may be of some use to the next person setting up for LT.

I just spoke with the tech guy at Fox, he was very little help as far as what to use for valving and springs, I'll be heading over to Kartech tomorrow and talk face to face with the counter guys, they seem to be pretty sharp, maybe hit up McKinzies too.

I know it’s not a Pilot and weight distribution is different but same numbers on one of the triple e cars I have. I’m not even sure if the rear springs are correct as the rear shocks on the buggy when I got it were off of a Ford Ranger. I assumed the springs were swapped over from the original rear shocks onto a set of Bilsteins. I will look for numbers on the other buggies. They now all run 10” fox shocks of one design or another. I messaged Farr about his setup and spring rates/valving etc. At the moment he only had spring numbers. Let us know how you like the LT setup from him as I am interested in that as well. You might try talking to scpilot. He runs his in the races in New Mexico and may shock info for you. I saw his latest post on fb about the race.
Bob

Farr? 12" shock or 12" shaft

went to his site it says 12" of travel
Ill assume it a 12" shaft at 1 to 1
100 over 150 will give you a combined rate of 60 until it hits the transition ( cross over collar) point if the new shock has one which i bet it does than your on the 150 at that point.
Dave-co rates are for a longer shaft if I remember.
ATVR is 125 over 150 which a lot of guys reverse the springs for a softer final rate of 125 versus the 150.
either way on the ATVR it 68. combined until transition. sag would remain the same either way.
if the sag is 2" that is only a 16 pound diff barley measurable. Fuel is around 7 pounds per gallon

valving will have an impact on this rate. softer comp valving will work with the heavier spring. less heat on shock.
under spring and over valving will result in a hotter running shock.

First I would consider what it what designed for by the guy who built it and than ask some questions like how much sag does that set up provide and at what point does it transition for a given Engine package and rider. then base your rate from that.

Also consider what have you done to the front if any thing it will have an impact on choice

I believe I had posted what I am running on my Dave-Co setup somwhere. I'll have to dig up my paperwork and post what I'm using. I wanna say 80/100lb springs.... maybe 180? It bottoms out on hard jumps but that's it.

I have looked over pics if Dave co. I see no crossover collars. These can be added to solve the bottom out on hard jumps. On can set so the tender spring goes in- active and main remains active at a stiffer rate
The spring seperator may bottom out on the pre load collar on his set up however not sure due to no measurements. I dout it though unless it's cranked down on preload.

I dug up the paperwork on my rear shocks, and here is what ive got.

- Fox 980-02-010 shocks. Dave had told me that he drills out the valving to make them flow enough for a buggy this light? Paid him like $100 to do this..... also i believe he said he runs 150PSI nitrogen in them.
- Springs are Eibach 1200.250.0080 and 1200.250.0100 so im guessing that is an 80 and 100lb spring.

and as far as a crossover collar, i do have them on my shocks but they are adjusted up so high they don't really do anything. Whats the proper way to go about adjusting these

EDIT: while i have my paperwork out, i am going to add the info for the front shocks as well in case anybody needs this in the future. I think the setup works fairly well, but im just some hillbilly... what do i know

- 18.8" Fox Zero X shocks from an Arctic Cat P/N 1703-538 & 1703-539 (only difference is the external reservoir line faces opposite ways for LH/RH, could run both the same part number without any real issue)
- Springs 2703-735 for the main spring and 1703-541 for the second spring. these are arctic cat part numbers

No modifications were done to the front shocks, they are bolted on right out of the box and work great.

the shocks are fox 12" travel, what about the effect that the gas pressure has? the shocks have a 7/8" shaft, I've heard that 150 psi is the min pressure you should run or you may have cavitation issues. Not sure what the results of the cavitation would be?
so at 150psi the shock will have the effect of acting like an air shock for about 90lb force, does this increase like a spring, I don't know.
the shocks are the Fox 2.0 factory series with DSC adjuster, the rezzies are 2.5", as this would give more force to get the oil in and have more force to push it back out I'm wondering what effect that will have on things, does that 90lbs become something greater, can I run lower pressure in the shock because of the larger rezzie?
I'm also thinking of changing the valving but would like some input if there are people that know something about shock valving. it's my understanding that the adjuster is only going to allow me to increase to the compression so I'm thinking rather than start at 50/70 which is where they are from the factory, change to 30 on the comp and maybe 50 on the rebound, not going to be a lot of spring trying to return the shocks and if I start at 30 on the comp then I'm hoping to be able to have the ability of cranking in more compression on the fly.

are your rear shocks 10 inch travel? if so then you may have the 5/8" shafts which means you have less force from the charge pressure. I think you are right on the interpretation of the spring rates, to me that sounds closer to the Dave-Co setup on Halo's pilot, his shocks are 14" which means he would have the 7/8" shaft but running the same spring rates as you.

My shocks are a 12" with a 7/8 shaft.

ok, 12" shaft lenght
80 over 100 or 44.444 for combined rate.

If the tender spring never gets to the cross over collars than its a straight rate of 44.4 for 12' or a bottom out poundage of 12 X 44.4 = 532.80

so moving the collars done allows the for more bottom out poundage.
How much, good question.
First you need to see where your stack is at free length. 12" + 12" + the separator thickness
Second Your pre-load is? Stack at free length or at a compressed state of ?

Example: 12 + 12+.5 for 24.5.
If you put on springs so there is no pre-load, run (top)nuts down to top of spring than your at zero pre-load
If you run the nut one inch than your stack is now @23.5 or 44.4 pounds of pre-load. This adds to the bottom out poundage. 44.4 +532.8 =577.20

Back to zero pre-load:
Put on machine get in and have friend push down a couple of times and role back and forth. Measure your spring stack. If the stack is now 20.5 your sag poundage is 4 X 44.4 =177.60
You now have 12" shaft -4" sag and 8" of compression (bump) travel or 8 x 44.4 =355.20 or 532.80-177.6=355.20

I like to separate bump from full Bottom out. This is why, when going into bump the hit for the most part does not have gravity and the full weight of the machine per say involved compared to landing a jump. This provides a smoother ride and good control for the most part.
Remember valving applies to the dynamic load and shaft speed. This is why if hit hard on a jump verses a bump unless its a sharp edge or big g-out.

So how can one help with out effecting the ride at bump. Move the collars down so the tender goes in-active achieving a higher spring load to help the valving at that shaft speed.

the example shows about a 33% sag so I would start with a 20% increase in shaft transition from full bottom than adjust from there.

so set the transition spacers for 1.6 " from full bottom adding around 90 lbs of help
10.4 X 44.4=461.71, 1.6 X 100=160, 461.71+160=621.71 - 532.80=88.91 increase
This will allow for 6" of bump travel @ 44.4 for ride and than add 90 for full compression hits.
Harder the hit increase spacer toward the spring seperator.

You want it to bottom just not hard every time. keep in mind you have a compression adjuster for High speed so 20% to start then add clicks. If you reach full clicks on high speed re-set high speed and add transition. If you add full 6" of transition change to a higher rate main spring.

keep in mind you have not changed your pre-load or you upset the balance you started with which will have great impact on handling.
If you like the ride and drive just need more rate for hits than do as mentioned.

The gas pressure in a dynamic state will yield little impact unless it is low and cavitate then your on the spring only and out of control.

Next chance I get I will explain how to get this number with the shock off the machine and set.
Most should be able to figure out based on rate. The spring compresses X per inch. X=base rate of single spring
So each spring will move X for a given poundage for a combined stack length. Then set you transition collar at that point.

Andoh, simple question, if this was your choice knowing that the shock is 12 inch travel and the suspension is 12", the mount is basicly the same for the ATV racing setup, Farr setup and Dave-Co setup but we have 3 different spring setups
ATVR 125/150
ATVR mod 100/150
Farr 100/150
Dave-Co 80/100

What would you select as a starting point?
I am asking you as you seem to actually have the most engineering experience and a good grasp on the subject