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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:49 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
Time to rebuild my master cylinder it started leaking fluid by the lever, its
the orignal so not a suprise it needs rebuilt, part number for the kit was
45530-HA8-771 price from Hillside Honda was $24.70

Follow the manual I am not going to duplicate what it says I am just
going to offer a few of my tips...

Here is the kit and old plunger

master cylinder rebuild


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:50 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
You cant see what way the cups face in the pics so I drew it with a marker on the
towel for future reference..


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:56 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
I lube the whole thing up with soap before I try to put the new rubber cups (seals)
on then put the first one on close to the end when you go to install the second one
it will want to fall into the groove of the frist one so I took some small zip ties
and a hose clamp to hold them in place, they are like a shoe horn so you can
slide the second seal to the back groove, lube it up and go, 4 tie wraps might be
even better but 2 worked good for me I went slow, what ever you use it must have
rounded corners something with a edge will cut the rubber seal because you will have
it stretched.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
Now its on you CAREFULLY remove the tie wraps and wash the soap off.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:58 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
I used a popcycle stick to push the new dust seal in, you need something
soft so it don't damage the seal.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 1:00 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
You gotta remove the steering cover to access the brake line (red arrow) before you install the
cover again you need to check the yoke nut (green arrow) to make sure its still
tight, over the years I have seen about a dozen Pilots with them loose, I also
put a dab of grease on all the screw openings so the threads wont rust in the
future (blue arrows)


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 2:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 10:31 pm
Posts: 5523
Location: New Jersey
I have a story to tell on this topic-
was having a heck of a time getting my fronts on my original Project Pilot to build pressure(soft lever)-from the get go it had an issue with them before the restoration, was not building pressure at all, bleed them with Mighty Vac-still no pressure.I was not leaking fluid-all the wheel cylinders,shoes,and associated hardware was brand new from Honda.After speaking with Hoser on the chat-we got into the actual CSI of the brakes in great detail.I went back-took both tires off and SPUN THE HUBS-they seemed to be "catching"on 1 side of the drum, there wasn't equal pressure-so I backed off the adjusters and took the drums off to make sure everything was good to go, mabye I had forgotten something-or even mabye I hadn't bled them out enough.Everything was good.I then tryed to tap the master cylinder thinking that I had air still in the bottom of the master perhaps, nothing.I then bled the system again for about 100 pulls on the lever-all fluid-so I ruled out air at this point.Again, went into the chat-talked about options-then decided and adjusting the shoes to max-then checking the lever for pressure-see what we have.Well -WAM-got great pressure on the lever at the master cylinder!!! so now we have CSI'D that indeed the master is in good operating order.Coarse of action now-the adjustment of the shoes- there isnt any other plausible explaination for the low pressure except that the shoes were not adjsuted properly-after visiting my manaul and again going into the chat for some help, I adjusted each shoe the same amount-1/2 turn to 1/2 turn checking each time the amount of "drag" on he drum.After checking the shoes to make sure they are adjusted equally and he drag on the drum is such that it is has a slight very slight amount on it-I check the lever-WAM-it is perfect-pulls about 1/2 way in and they both lock up from a good heavy throttle.So, the moral of the story is that you may think the master is bad-but checking the brake adjustment could be a easy way to save you a dollar and some aggravation for sure.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 7:27 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:15 pm
Posts: 631
Location: Fredon,NJ
Nice - MUD!!!

been having trouble....thinkin the master was not good......very low brake lever, but they worked......I went to the adjustemnt and started from scratch....seemed one shoe was adjusted out slightly more than the other.....now they are even and the lever is high same as the rear.

Thanks


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:05 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:48 pm
Posts: 1036
Location: CT
Easiest way to set the adjustment and bleed the system is to adjust the adjusters for each shoe until the shoe is in full contact with the drum. Bleed the system, then back the shoes off an equal amount and check for excessive drag. Adjusting oneshoe then teh next can lead to improper adjustment. The first shoe is already doing the draggingso an ever so slight drag of the second shoe will appear to be adjusted when it really is not. Bleeding the system with the shoes in full contact with the drum prevents air from being stuck in the wheel cylinder and simply going back and forth with the motion of the cylinder. (the piston does not extend out to move the shoes outward because the shoes are already out as far as they can go) This reduces the amount of time it takes to bleed and increases thechance of getting all the air out the first time.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:27 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:40 am
Posts: 346
Location: Australia
Same topic but different machine. I have a Yamaha WR426 that I just can`t get the "sponge feel" out of the lever,I have fitted new pads,replaced fluid,bled the system even removed the master cylinder and hung it up so no air would be trapped in the bend of the hose , still no success. The front will lock up but you can pull the lever right back up against the throttle.
Any sugestions?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:36 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22128
Location: Chicago
lc4 wrote:
Same topic but different machine. I have a Yamaha WR426 that I just can`t get the "sponge feel" out of the lever,I have fitted new pads,replaced fluid,bled the system even removed the master cylinder and hung it up so no air would be trapped in the bend of the hose , still no success. The front will lock up but you can pull the lever right back up against the throttle.
Any sugestions?


Disc brakes?


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 5:45 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:40 am
Posts: 346
Location: Australia
Yes Hoser its fitted with disc brakes (2002 model)


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 12:41 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 29, 2004 4:48 pm
Posts: 1036
Location: CT
Does the front brake hose loop underneath the caliper? Easiest way I found to bleed bike brakes is to get a spare master cylinder cover, drill and tap it. Put a fitting in the cover and pressurize the system with a few pounds of regulated air pressure. This will force the air out that is stuck in loop under the caliper. Keep a close eye on the fluid level. It will drop fast.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2008 1:17 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 4:54 pm
Posts: 1360
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
that a great idea KX King


heres some things i have noticed,

First be sure there isnt a little air bubble under the plastic cap in the reservoir

the hanging the caliper trick works but usually you leave it sit over night, this allows a bubble half way in line time to travel to elevated end, then bleed it in the morning

the other way that sometimes works and without pulling caliper, is to pull the brake pads and pump a bunch of fuild into the caliper, over extend the pistons but becareful not to let the pistons pop out, i use a tire iron for pads and then to push the pistons all the way back in, you can repeat and try to bleed off air when fully pumped, and when collasped or when ever you think you have air near there..

once you get it you will know it, it will firm right up

This is unless it is wore out and is bypassing fuild inside the master cylinder but that shows by a constant steady lost of lever pressure


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:26 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:40 am
Posts: 346
Location: Australia
King Kx wrote:
Does the front brake hose loop underneath the caliper? Easiest way I found to bleed bike brakes is to get a spare master cylinder cover, drill and tap it. Put a fitting in the cover and pressurize the system with a few pounds of regulated air pressure. This will force the air out that is stuck in loop under the caliper. Keep a close eye on the fluid level. It will drop fast.


Yes the line does loop down under the caliper. What I`m going to try next is to force fluid back the other way towards the master cylinder. Hopefully this will force any air out.
I`ve even tried the trick of holding the brake lever back with a cable tie over night in hope of any air to pass through the system to the highest point,didn`t work.


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