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 Post subject: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 2:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Here is my piston collection so far Baahahahaha.
Finished putting my brothers Engine together last night and will install sometime today.
Still have to do a vacuum and pressure test before I flash it up later this week.
Took the performance cyl off and now have a stock cyl on it that I got from BS.
Hopefully that will stop this piston eating contest and my brothers machine will run.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 8:45 pm
Posts: 2243
Well they are looking better down the line at least! lol I have more than that so I feel your pain brother.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 4:30 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Nuke Em wrote:
Well they are looking better down the line at least! lol I have more than that so I feel your pain brother.


Yeah I just laugh about it now.
I like building engines anyways. Got a nice shop.
Hopefully this next one runs.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 6:47 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Well well well. Looks like I found the Engine issue and I feel stupid now.
I tried to do a vacuum and pressure test and they both failed bad.
As fast as I could vacuum or add pressure the faster it dropped. I could here hissing.
Managed to trace it down to the intake boot and I can't believe what I saw.
The monkeys die grindered the intake boot so that the 42mm Mikuni would fit. This is the
carb that the oddy came with when I bought it. I guess when they die grindered the boot they
must have poke a hole through and they covered it up with some rubber stuff. It looks like they
used liquid tape. I feel real stupid right now because I noticed these die grinder marks in the
boot during previous rebuilds but just didn't put two n two together. I also didn't notice the liquid
tape they used to fix it but noticed it now because it became unlaminated. Attention to detail I guess
I don't have as I am a heavy industry mechanic and everything is done with a torch and hammer LOL.
Usually I notice stuff. What a moron I am. Oh well I know now. When I read some of Hoser's threads
there are comments like "wrong nut or poor old gasket removal" , I usually grin a bit. Well the joke is
on me and it cost me money. If you look close at the one photo you can see the die grinder marks. The other photo shows the patch stuff they applied. Sorry for poor picture quality. The strange thing is during previous rebuilds it always pasted the tests. I don't put an Engine in unless it holds pressure for at least a half hour or more. My Engine on oddzilla #1 holds for days but this one on oddzilla #2 never held pressure for more than minutes.


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intake 2.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 7:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22617
Location: Chicago
canadian oddy wrote:
Well well well. Looks like I found the Engine issue and I feel stupid now.
I tried to do a vacuum and pressure test and they both failed bad.
As fast as I could vacuum or add pressure the faster it dropped. I could here hissing.
Managed to trace it down to the intake boot and I can't believe what I saw.
The monkeys die grindered the intake boot so that the 42mm Mikuni would fit. This is the
carb that the oddy came with when I bought it. I guess when they die grindered the boot they
must have poke a hole through and they covered it up with some rubber stuff. It looks like they
used liquid tape. I feel real stupid right now because I noticed these die grinder marks in the
boot during previous rebuilds but just didn't put two n two together. I also didn't notice the liquid
tape they used to fix it but noticed it now because it became unlaminated. Attention to detail I guess
I don't have as I am a heavy industry mechanic and everything is done with a torch and hammer LOL.
Usually I notice stuff. What a moron I am. Oh well I know now. When I read some of Hoser's threads
there are comments like "wrong nut or poor old gasket removal" , I usually grin a bit. Well the joke is
on me and it cost me money. If you look close at the one photo you can see the die grinder marks. The other photo shows the patch stuff they applied. Sorry for poor picture quality. The strange thing is during previous rebuilds it always pasted the tests. I don't put an Engine in unless it holds pressure for at least a half hour or more. My Engine on oddzilla #1 holds for days but this one on oddzilla #2 never held pressure for more than minutes.


Well that sucks maybe its time for a Dan i Fold?


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:23 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:41 pm
Posts: 624
Location: mustang,ok
good grief i thought i was hard headed. That one cost you 5 bills .Here is all I am going to say on the board if you want more info you can pm me , if it was me I would go with the danifold instead of the other offering out there . Trust me voice of experience .


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:50 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
dbloudharleys wrote:
good grief i thought i was hard headed. That one cost you 5 bills .Here is all I am going to say on the board if you want more info you can pm me , if it was me I would go with the danifold instead of the other offering out there . Trust me voice of experience .


LOL yeah I am hard headed because I am a square head (German).
I am in the process tonight of actually building my own intake.
I might post pictures for all to laugh at.
My brother bought an aftermarket intake from Aftersucks. To much wrong with this thing to write
about here as I would run out of space. What junk and it leaked too.
P.S. the first two pistons in the picture weren't a result of the intake leak. It was because it had 170psi static and we ran premium gas (91 octane) instead of AVGAS.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 5:07 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 10:13 am
Posts: 3767
Location: PERTH WESTERN AUSTRALIA
Do you have your corresponding spark plugs to match the "pissed-on" congo line? :-)


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 12:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:21 am
Posts: 2681
Location: NW Ohio / SE Michigan
hoser wrote:
canadian oddy wrote:
Well well well. Looks like I found the Engine issue and I feel stupid now.
I tried to do a vacuum and pressure test and they both failed bad.
As fast as I could vacuum or add pressure the faster it dropped. I could here hissing.
Managed to trace it down to the intake boot and I can't believe what I saw.
The monkeys die grindered the intake boot so that the 42mm Mikuni would fit. This is the
carb that the oddy came with when I bought it. I guess when they die grindered the boot they
must have poke a hole through and they covered it up with some rubber stuff. It looks like they
used liquid tape. I feel real stupid right now because I noticed these die grinder marks in the
boot during previous rebuilds but just didn't put two n two together. I also didn't notice the liquid
tape they used to fix it but noticed it now because it became unlaminated. Attention to detail I guess
I don't have as I am a heavy industry mechanic and everything is done with a torch and hammer LOL.
Usually I notice stuff. What a moron I am. Oh well I know now. When I read some of Hoser's threads
there are comments like "wrong nut or poor old gasket removal" , I usually grin a bit. Well the joke is
on me and it cost me money. If you look close at the one photo you can see the die grinder marks. The other photo shows the patch stuff they applied. Sorry for poor picture quality. The strange thing is during previous rebuilds it always pasted the tests. I don't put an Engine in unless it holds pressure for at least a half hour or more. My Engine on oddzilla #1 holds for days but this one on oddzilla #2 never held pressure for more than minutes.


Well that sucks maybe its time for a Dan i Fold?


In stock and ready to ship! :-) lol


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:32 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
DMoneyAllstar wrote:
hoser wrote:
canadian oddy wrote:
Well well well. Looks like I found the Engine issue and I feel stupid now.
I tried to do a vacuum and pressure test and they both failed bad.
As fast as I could vacuum or add pressure the faster it dropped. I could here hissing.
Managed to trace it down to the intake boot and I can't believe what I saw.
The monkeys die grindered the intake boot so that the 42mm Mikuni would fit. This is the
carb that the oddy came with when I bought it. I guess when they die grindered the boot they
must have poke a hole through and they covered it up with some rubber stuff. It looks like they
used liquid tape. I feel real stupid right now because I noticed these die grinder marks in the
boot during previous rebuilds but just didn't put two n two together. I also didn't notice the liquid
tape they used to fix it but noticed it now because it became unlaminated. Attention to detail I guess
I don't have as I am a heavy industry mechanic and everything is done with a torch and hammer LOL.
Usually I notice stuff. What a moron I am. Oh well I know now. When I read some of Hoser's threads
there are comments like "wrong nut or poor old gasket removal" , I usually grin a bit. Well the joke is
on me and it cost me money. If you look close at the one photo you can see the die grinder marks. The other photo shows the patch stuff they applied. Sorry for poor picture quality. The strange thing is during previous rebuilds it always pasted the tests. I don't put an Engine in unless it holds pressure for at least a half hour or more. My Engine on oddzilla #1 holds for days but this one on oddzilla #2 never held pressure for more than minutes.


Well that sucks maybe its time for a Dan i Fold?


In stock and ready to ship! :-) lol


Thanks I will keep you in mind for sure.
Just want to see if I can make one --- I'm a curious bugger
Bugeye no I don't have the plugs


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:07 am
Posts: 421
Location: Cheyenne, Wyoming
bugeye59 wrote:
Do you have your corresponding spark plugs to match the "pissed-on" congo line? :-)

Those first two pistons could have parts of melted spark plugs if that counts :-)


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Sun Jun 22, 2014 2:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:58 pm
Posts: 363
Location: Anniston, Al
canadian oddy wrote:
Well well well. Looks like I found the Engine issue and I feel stupid now.
I tried to do a vacuum and pressure test and they both failed bad.
As fast as I could vacuum or add pressure the faster it dropped. I could here hissing.
Managed to trace it down to the intake boot and I can't believe what I saw.
The monkeys die grindered the intake boot so that the 42mm Mikuni would fit. This is the
carb that the oddy came with when I bought it. I guess when they die grindered the boot they
must have poke a hole through and they covered it up with some rubber stuff. It looks like they
used liquid tape. I feel real stupid right now because I noticed these die grinder marks in the
boot during previous rebuilds but just didn't put two n two together. I also didn't notice the liquid
tape they used to fix it but noticed it now because it became unlaminated. Attention to detail I guess
I don't have as I am a heavy industry mechanic and everything is done with a torch and hammer LOL.
Usually I notice stuff. What a moron I am. Oh well I know now. When I read some of Hoser's threads
there are comments like "wrong nut or poor old gasket removal" , I usually grin a bit. Well the joke is
on me and it cost me money. If you look close at the one photo you can see the die grinder marks. The other photo shows the patch stuff they applied. Sorry for poor picture quality. The strange thing is during previous rebuilds it always pasted the tests. I don't put an Engine in unless it holds pressure for at least a half hour or more. My Engine on oddzilla #1 holds for days but this one on oddzilla #2 never held pressure for more than minutes.

Ok enough BS you know you put that can of liquid tape on there just to mess with us.. LOL I have used Bed Liner before on a friends Honda 650 that we restored and he road it for years until a guy at a rally in SC wanted it more than he did and bought it. No joke I was on a ride one time and found a crack in one of the boots on my 750 and used a hot patch to get back home.. Now that was back in the day.. Thanks Billy


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:17 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
You can't do that and expect it to hold on an FL350. It might work long enough to get you back to camp but it won't last for any longer than that. The carb mount is designed so that it flexes somewhat and any bubble gum and Band Aid fix will only fail and run the risk of burning another Engine down.

Ever watch how much an fl350 Engine moves when it's idling or when torque is put to the clutch?

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:58 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Randman wrote:
You can't do that and expect it to hold on an FL350. It might work long enough to get you back to camp but it won't last for any longer than that. The carb mount is designed so that it flexes somewhat and any bubble gum and Band Aid fix will only fail and run the risk of burning another Engine down.

Ever watch how much an fl350 Engine moves when it's idling or when torque is put to the clutch?

Rand


Yup I agree and that's why I made a new intake.
Its not quite a "Daniflold" but I am gona give it a try. The price was right and so was the experience.
Engine is just completing the pressure and vacuum tests as I write this. Will post a photo of it in the next hour or so.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:35 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:58 pm
Posts: 363
Location: Anniston, Al
Got a question, why are you only drilling two holes in the piston at the bridge area? Are those not wiseco pistons? Just wondering. Thought I may have missed something... LOL Thanks Billy


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:17 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
birvin wrote:
Got a question, why are you only drilling two holes in the piston at the bridge area? Are those not wiseco pistons? Just wondering. Thought I may have missed something... LOL Thanks Billy


Yup I think you are missing something LOL.
Read the wiseco instructions. It says: "drill 2 holes (.060-.090" dia) .375" apart, starting .300" below the bottom ring, and between the pencil lines. See illustration B".
That is word for word from wiseco instructions. The real funny part is "illustration B" shows 3 holes.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:10 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2012 12:58 pm
Posts: 363
Location: Anniston, Al
canadian oddy wrote:
birvin wrote:
Got a question, why are you only drilling two holes in the piston at the bridge area? Are those not wiseco pistons? Just wondering. Thought I may have missed something... LOL Thanks Billy


Yup I think you are missing something LOL.
Read the wiseco instructions. It says: "drill 2 holes (.060-.090" dia) .375" apart, starting .300" below the bottom ring, and between the pencil lines. See illustration B".
That is word for word from wiseco instructions. The real funny part is "illustration B" shows 3 holes.

Yea I noticed that two when I was prepping my piston so I called wiseco and ask them. This is what a guy named Jeff in the teck. department told me. The holes are for cooling the bridge and it does say to drill two holes BUT you can drill three and it would help it cool alittle bit more. I thought that it had been covered on here before, I searched and didn't find it. But I was asking because you were having a problem burning pistons. I ask about the extra mixture that it would be bringing up and he said that the ports would take care of it. Hope this helped. Thanks Billy


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:00 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
I am currently having ignition issues with the machine. I am thinking that might be some of my piston issues


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:57 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 1:26 pm
Posts: 38
When you do a vacuum test how much pressure should you use.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:20 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2007 10:52 pm
Posts: 511
Location: Milwaukie, Oregon
canadian oddy wrote:
birvin wrote:
Got a question, why are you only drilling two holes in the piston at the bridge area? Are those not wiseco pistons? Just wondering. Thought I may have missed something... LOL Thanks Billy


Yup I think you are missing something LOL.
Read the wiseco instructions. It says: "drill 2 holes (.060-.090" dia) .375" apart, starting .300" below the bottom ring, and between the pencil lines. See illustration B".
That is word for word from wiseco instructions. The real funny part is "illustration B" shows 3 holes.
\

Wiseco must have made more than one set of instructions, I have instructions that say to drill 3 holes.

Locate and drill in the center, between the two pencil lines, three 3/32"/2.4mm lubrication holes at the following points measured down from the bottom edge of the LOWEST ring groove.
First hole 3/8" / 9mm down.
2nd hole 5/8" / 16mm down.
3rd hole 7/8 / 22mm down.

these instructions came from a fl350 piston set I bought over 4 years ago.

Bob ::-:


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:23 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
atc250r wrote:
When you do a vacuum test how much pressure should you use.


I do 10" of vacuum and it must hold for half hour or more or I don't run it.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:04 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2012 3:19 am
Posts: 7910
Location: Hope, B.C Canada
Well time to add one more to the collection.
But this time I figured it out.
Fuel pump.
Delivered just enough to keep the engines running.
My brother noticed not enough fuel in filter.


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:40 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
The fuel filter doesn't always run with it filled completely with fuel.

Rand


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 10:27 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2003 2:40 pm
Posts: 22617
Location: Chicago
Randman wrote:
The fuel filter doesn't always run with it filled completely with fuel.

Rand

Correct the fullness of the fuel filter will depend on orientation, vibration, temperature, the amount of additives in the fuel you bought that day, temp, time of year and probably a whole bunch of other things, if your fuel system is not 100% OEM then mount the fuel filter higher than the carb with the outlet vertical pointing towards the carb putting the air gap (gas vapor gap) to the top of the filter on the inlet side this will help ensure their is a adequate amount of fuel getting to the carb.

I bought a FL250 once that came with a after market filter and hose routing the previous owner had drilled a hole in the filter and installed a small screw to seal the whole, I discovered why sometimes the 250 would vapor lock and you had to remove the screw to let the filter fill with gas again, this only happen every once in a great while but it did happen, I ended up changing the routing and filter location where it acted like a fuel log cured the problem, people need to understand the fuel systems on these machines are ENGINEERED and DESIGNED with great thought and expense and that the chances of them being smarter than the MFG when making design changes is slim to none chances are they are going to create problems that may happen right now or just once every 20-30 hrs run time, lean condition as it runs out of fuel followed by a poofkaboom another piston paper weight.

A good friend of mine crashed his ultra light plane after he modified the fuel system and installed a "cheater tank" a gas tank that held more than 5 gallons of gas, ran good on the ground for the 2-3 minutes he let it idle to warm up before take off, when he got about 300' in the air the fuel system vapor locked and he crash landed after avoiding power lines and a hwy full of traffic, we talked the day before about hooking the plane to my truck and running it WOT (Wide Open Throttle) on the ground for 4 gallons of gas to test but he seem to forget about that little detail haha he was lucky he walked away and it was only a 7500 mistake, I asked him what the range of the new 'cheater tank' was now as we picked up the pieces of his totaled plane lol


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 Post subject: Re: My piston collection
PostPosted: Sat Jun 28, 2014 7:12 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:10 am
Posts: 4678
Location: Carson City NV
This is a common issue when running fuel filters in the Engine compartment in Volkswagen bugs. Everyone installs the aftermarket transparent fuel filter and then scratch their heads when they look to see the fuel filter isn't completely full of fuel. They think the filter has to be full and start screwing around with the system to try and fit it.

You can't see the Ody filter easily but it too will run not completely full of fuel and still operate as designed.

Rand


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